Ask an African-American anything

[annienormanna]

crimsonguard said:

annienormanna said:

Sicilians are as Peloponnese as any modern Greek. Except better

Some Athenian Greeks can't get past that we annihilated their great fleet and drove their invading army back across the Sea with the help of our blood-brother's the Spartans... ;D I kid!

Plus, we fed the Romans when they couldn't do it for themselves. ;D

[Crimson Guard]

Only when our Roman cousins landed in Siciily,where they ever able to conquer the then known world!

I think the only way the Italians will ever again become a great race and new Roman Empire,is if Sicily once more becomes such a rich and glorious country like it once was. Frederick II was on the right track,but was betrayed by the German Prince's and Italian Pope.

[annienormanna]

crimsonguard said:

Only when our Roman cousins landed in Siciily,where they ever able to conquer the then known world!

I think the only way the Italians will ever again become a great race and new Roman Empire,is if Sicily once more becomes such a rich and glorious country like it once was. Frederick II was on the right track,but was betrayed by the German Prince's and Italian Pope.

Sicily has been rich many times over.

[Dienekes]

Being in a city state doesn't make one Greek. City states are just one particular political organization that some Greeks had during classical times. By that dubious recknoning, Achilles and Odysseus who were Greek kings before the emergence of city states were not Greek either.

Macedonians were definitely a northern Greek tribe, but the Greekness of Alexander and the royal house of Macedonia was even stricter in the sense of being descended from the Herclids of Argos.

Modern Sicilians are not Greek in any sense. They lost their Hellenicity in late ancient and medieval times and are now thoroughly Latinized. They do share more genetic and cultural similarities with the Greeks though, compared to other foreigners.

[annienormanna]

admin said:

Modern Sicilians are not Greek in any sense. They lost their Hellenicity in late ancient and medieval times and are now thoroughly Latinized. They do share more genetic and cultural similarities with the Greeks though, compared to other foreigners.

So, you don't deny common ancestry. Being a Greek is fine. I think Sicilians have enough sense as a people to distinguish themselves from Modern Greeks. I mean, it's not like we want to be Greek

[Dienekes]

annienormanna said:

I mean, it's not like we want to be Greek

Indeed. If you had wanted to be Greek you wouldn't speak the language of your Roman conquerors.

[Crimson Guard]

admin said:

Being in a city state doesn't make one Greek. City states are just one particular political organization that some Greeks had during classical times. By that dubious recknoning, Achilles and Odysseus who were Greek kings before the emergence of city states were not Greek either. >>


Macedonians were definitely a northern Greek tribe, but the Greekness of Alexander and the royal house of Macedonia was even stricter in the sense of being descended from the Herclids of Argos.

Modern Sicilians are not Greek in any sense. They lost their Hellenicity in late ancient and medieval times and are now thoroughly Latinized. They do share more genetic and cultural similarities with the Greeks though, compared to other foreigners.

Well Achilles ect wouldve been Achaeans,if at all they ever existed yes.

The ancient concept of statehood was/is different ,and Greece was never a unified people or nation until Philip /Alexander and again under the Roman Conquerors.Proto-Greeks & Greeks where more about blood & culture not limited to any one particular land,language is debatable ,they where a migrating people you know that.

Alexander's Royal Bloodline is itself dubious and sketchy and open for interpretation. Olympias was known for her rather insane claims,and historians are where just as confused. Much of Alexander's life and family are a mystery.

The Greeks themselves would have lost their "Hellenicity " as well ,if it was not for the Latin's preserving and continuing it. Modern Hellenism was born out've Romanism. So I think the Latin/Hellenic barrier line is a very thin and weak argument and doesn't mean much,perhaps never did.

So once we get rid of these modern constrictions of contemporary Statehood/Nationhood,Italians and Greeks are pretty much the same,just as we where under the Roman Empire .

Even the Latin and Greek mythology are so intertwined,their was more Greeks and Greek Temples in Southern Italy and Sicily than in Greece. Just shows their connection and brotherhood, Graecus and Latinus where brothers after all.



So if Sicilians arent "Greek in any sense" modern or ancient according to you then why did you state this and use Sicilians to make a broad conclussion on the old Greek mainland population:


<<It is unfortunate that a mainland Greek sample was not included, but to make up for it, there is a Cypriot sample, in addition to three Sicilian samples. These populations which are largely of Greek origin are very similar to Greeks in general, and belong to the Central-East cluster. Their inclusion also allow us to test my previously expressed hypothesis that haplogroup R1a1 was rare in ancient Greek populations. Indeed, this haplogroup is found at a frequency of 1.8-3.1% in Sicilians, Cypriots and Southern Italians, thus essentially confirming my idea>>

So we are either Greek,but yet not,but yet still are???No more of this beating around the bush nonsense. And when you earliar made the minimizing ,lumping in of Sicilians with Turks and Bulgarians was a big mistake,LoL!

Dont worry though I'am not out to be "Greek"...Sicilians are in fact "Magna Graecian" (Greater Greek) or alternative name "Greco-Roman" which is my ancestrial culture up to the present !

Ancient Sicilians where always Tri-Lingual with Latin,Punic and Greek,which still forms the basis of the Sicilian language,everything to be proud of.

[pegasos]

Why do african american women have so large asses (asscheeks)?

And, do they like anal sex?

[durnisi]

admin said:

annienormanna said:

I mean, it's not like we want to be Greek

Indeed. If you had wanted to be Greek you wouldn't speak the language of your Roman conquerors.

Greek was spoken in Messina until 1500 A.D....

[annienormanna]

admin said:

annienormanna said:

I mean, it's not like we want to be Greek

Indeed. If you had wanted to be Greek you wouldn't speak the language of your Roman conquerors.

You fell behind

[Dienekes]

crimsonguard said:

Alexander's Royal Bloodline is itself dubious and sketchy and open for interpretation. Olympias was known for her rather insane claims,and historians are where just as confused. Much of Alexander's life and family are a mystery.

It wasn't Olympias who made an "insane claim", but rather Alexander I, and his claim was accepted by the Hellanodikai at Olympia, who were the only authorities on Greekness in ancient times.

The Greeks themselves would have lost their "Hellenicity " as well ,if it was not for the Latin's preserving and continuing it.

You are either joking or ignorant. The Greek language and culture persisted among the Greeks, not among the Romans, whose knowledge of Greek faded quickly after they were conquered by the barbarians. Indeed, in medieval times there were reputedly 6-7 people in the entire Latin West who could even understand Greek, hence the saying "It's all Greek to me".

Modern Hellenism was born out've Romanism. So I think the Latin/Hellenic barrier line is a very thin and weak argument and doesn't mean much,perhaps never did.

Indeed, the modern Greeks are descendants of the medieval Romans who were Greek speaking. It was a peculiar turn of events that the heirs of the Roman Empire were the Greeks and not the natives of central Italy.

So once we get rid of these modern constrictions of contemporary Statehood/Nationhood,Italians and Greeks are pretty much the same,just as we where under the Roman Empire .

Italians and Greeks are not the same, but they do have some genetic and cultural similarities.

So if Sicilians arent "Greek in any sense" modern or ancient according to you then why did you state this and use Sicilians to make a broad conclussion on the old Greek mainland population:


<<It is unfortunate that a mainland Greek sample was not included, but to make up for it, there is a Cypriot sample, in addition to three Sicilian samples. These populations which are largely of Greek origin are very similar to Greeks in general, and belong to the Central-East cluster. Their inclusion also allow us to test my previously expressed hypothesis that haplogroup R1a1 was rare in ancient Greek populations. Indeed, this haplogroup is found at a frequency of 1.8-3.1% in Sicilians, Cypriots and Southern Italians, thus essentially confirming my idea>>

Well, my interest is in determining historic and prehistoric migrations. As I have mentioned above, Sicilians do have Greek ancestry, but they are not Greek because they have been cut off from the Greek nation.

As I mentioned above, it is neither biology nor culture alone which defines Greekness, but rather both common ancestry and common culture.

So we are either Greek,but yet not,but yet still are???No more of this beating around the bush nonsense. And when you earliar made the minimizing ,lumping in of Sicilians with Turks and Bulgarians was a big mistake,LoL!

You are genetically more descended from Greeks than, say, Spaniards, or Swedes are. Genetics alone does not suffice to make you Greek.

And, indeed you are similar to Turks and Bulgarians, because like them you have some Greek ancestry, but speak a foreign language that replaced Greek.

[Dienekes]

durnisi said:

[
Greek was spoken in Messina until 1500 A.D....

Then 1,500+x AD marks the end of the Greeks of Sicily.

[annienormanna]

admin said:

crimsonguard said:

Alexander's Royal Bloodline is itself dubious and sketchy and open for interpretation. Olympias was known for her rather insane claims,and historians are where just as confused. Much of Alexander's life and family are a mystery.

And, indeed you are similar to Turks and Bulgarians, because like them you have some Greek ancestry, but speak a foreign language that replaced Greek.

Sicilian is not a "foreign language" in Sicily.

[durnisi]

admin said:

durnisi said:

[
Greek was spoken in Messina until 1500 A.D....

Then 1,500+x AD marks the end of the Greeks of Sicily.

Correct. Sicily was re-hellenized with the Byzantines, re-latinized with the Normans.

[annienormanna]

annienormanna said:

admin said:

And, indeed you are similar to Turks and Bulgarians, because like them you have some Greek ancestry, but speak a foreign language that replaced Greek.

Sicilian is not a "foreign language" in Sicily.

Personally, I have no problem with your claim, Dienekes.
But no one owns history. Not even the Greeks.