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Post by MC anunnaki on Sept 1, 2005 6:03:26 GMT -5
In this event, white Europeans would since long have been rushing to marry black Africans. But this is not the case. It's not the case because dark pigmentation isn't rare, like I wrote. We have a lot of black/white Swedes who're rather "old" (in their 30s-40s) who're the product of race-mixing between Swedes and Africans when Africans first started arriving here. Today, most groups of people aren't exotic anymore since people here have gotten used to them. There aren't many black Africans in Scandinavia but I can assure you that those who are here more often have Scandinavian girlfriends/wifes rather than say East Asian, Middle Eastern or South European. In most cases it's white female/black male, although I've seen a couple of white male/black female pairings. I've noticed quite a lot of Swedish men who prefer East Asian women to white women.
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Post by MC anunnaki on Sept 1, 2005 6:04:47 GMT -5
Do you mean Ottomans or Arabs? I know Vikings sailed as far as Istanbul, but further than that? Well, there was no Istanbul in the Viking age, back then it was still called Constantinople. I mean Arabs who had a florishing trade in North European sakaliba, mostly for army and harems. Yes, I know, but Constantinople wasn't exactly filled with Arabs (and Istanbul isn't filled with them either). What is "sakaliba"? How extensive were the meetings between Northern Europeans and Arabs (not Ottoman Turks)?
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Post by MC anunnaki on Sept 1, 2005 6:06:21 GMT -5
I am not sure Arab women were as free as to have their own male harems. Of course blond boys were sought after by gay Arabs who were possibly more numerous than straight ones. This has to be the most groundless statement of the week. So you claim gay Arabs outnumbered the straight ones?
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aeon
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Post by aeon on Sept 1, 2005 6:27:15 GMT -5
I am not sure Arab women were as free as to have their own male harems. Of course blond boys were sought after by gay Arabs who were possibly more numerous than straight ones. This has to be the most groundless statement of the week. So you claim gay Arabs outnumbered the straight ones? I believe bisexual Arabs outnumbered straight ones. But it can be neither proved nor refuted.
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aeon
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Post by aeon on Sept 1, 2005 6:33:51 GMT -5
Yes, I know, but Constantinople wasn't exactly filled with Arabs (and Istanbul isn't filled with them either). What is "sakaliba"? How extensive were the meetings between Northern Europeans and Arabs (not Ottoman Turks)? Sakaliba is the name of North European slaves in the Arab world. They were very numerous. Some of them even took power like in Muslim Spain in the 11th century. Meetings between Northern Europeans and Arabs were very extensive, from Spain to Iraq. Viking trade expeditions reached as far as Baghdad.
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Post by MC anunnaki on Sept 1, 2005 6:43:43 GMT -5
I believe bisexual Arabs outnumbered straight ones. But it can be neither proved nor refuted. What makes you believe this? Moors in Spain encountering Northern Europeans, that makes sense, but I've never heard of Viking trades reaching as far as Baghdad. This is a map I found on Viking routes. And another: And yet another: From this site: www.arild-hauge.com/eraids.htmEDIT:This site writes: There were Swedes that went on voyages with the Danes and Norwegians (at that time the differences between the countries were much less than they are now), but the main stream of Swedish Vikings went eastward. They travelled much farther east than any other European people. The Swedish Vikings even travelled as far as Jerusalem (or Jorsalir as they called it), the Caspian sea, and Baghdad (they called it Särkland). Hundreds of Swedes travelled to the eastern Roman city Constantinople (or Miklagård). Many of them returned rich from their combined trading/plundering expeditions.
There are more ancient English coins found in Sweden than there are in England, and over 90% of all the coins found in Europe from Baghdad and surroundings have been found in Sweden (Gotland to be precise). Source: www.luth.se/luth/present/sweden/history/viking_age/Viking_age4.htmlIn school, all we were taught was that the Vikings got as far as Constantinople. Damn history teachers.
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aeon
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Post by aeon on Sept 1, 2005 7:04:04 GMT -5
Anunnaki, your own source says:
There were Swedes that went on voyages with the Danes and Norwegians (at that time the differences between the countries were much less than they are now), but the main stream of Swedish Vikings went eastward. They travelled much farther east than any other European people. The Swedish Vikings even travelled as far as Jerusalem (or Jorsalir as they called it), the Caspian sea, and Baghdad (they called it Särkland).
All three of your maps show routes leading across the Caspian Sea. Their ultimate destination is Baghdad.
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Post by wardner on Sept 1, 2005 7:09:11 GMT -5
Manga/anime character design is heavily influenced by western comics, so it's no surprise if manga characters look like a blend of caucasoid traits with a more abstract, cartoonistic style developed over the years. Some manga are clearly influenced by western-style Others have a deformed, cartoonistic appearance: Btw, even italians comics show a heavy influence from american comics, expecially DC ones: Many characters are long-skulled, big-jawed yankee-looking heroes. Most of the stories, are nonetheless placed in America or Uk.
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Post by MC anunnaki on Sept 1, 2005 7:16:07 GMT -5
Anunnaki, your own source says: There were Swedes that went on voyages with the Danes and Norwegians (at that time the differences between the countries were much less than they are now), but the main stream of Swedish Vikings went eastward. They travelled much farther east than any other European people. The Swedish Vikings even travelled as far as Jerusalem (or Jorsalir as they called it), the Caspian sea, and Baghdad (they called it Särkland). All three of your maps show routes leading across the Caspian Sea. Their ultimate destination is Baghdad. This is the first time I've heard Baghdad is Särkland. All through school, Särkland has been associated with Constantinople and the Ottoman Turks who wore similar garbs (särk ~ dress). If you go across the Caspian, you will end up in what used to be Persia, not in Baghdad. I'm still curious as to what makes you believe the majority of Arabs where bisexual or gay.
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aeon
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Post by aeon on Sept 1, 2005 7:23:58 GMT -5
Sarkland is generally Arab lands, not Constantinople (Miklagard) and definitely not Ottoman Turks who entered the historical arena many centuries later. Vikings travelled by water. They went down the Volga and through the Caspian sea and Iran (which anyway was in Arabs' hands) reached Baghdad.
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Post by MC anunnaki on Sept 1, 2005 7:27:04 GMT -5
Do you have any sources I could study further? Like I said, in our history books, Särkland is Constantinople. This is a first for me.
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aeon
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Post by aeon on Sept 1, 2005 7:29:44 GMT -5
In this event, white Europeans would since long have been rushing to marry black Africans. But this is not the case. It's not the case because dark pigmentation isn't rare, like I wrote. We have a lot of black/white Swedes who're rather "old" (in their 30s-40s) who're the product of race-mixing between Swedes and Africans when Africans first started arriving here. Today, most groups of people aren't exotic anymore since people here have gotten used to them. Blacks were rare in Europe for 2,500 years, still I can not remember any rush among Europeans to marry them. Your theory does not hold water.
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Post by MC anunnaki on Sept 1, 2005 7:33:44 GMT -5
Blacks were rare in Europe for 2,500 years, still I can not remember any rush among Europeans to marry them. Your theory does not hold water. How many blacks where in Northern Europe 2500 years ago and how do you know that they didn't breed with Northern Euros? I'd be surprised if you remembered what happened 2500 years ago. AFAIK, black slaves existed in southern Europe during the Roman Empire, but I've never heard of blacks making it as far as present-day Germany or Sweden. If you have any sources, then do share them.
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aeon
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Post by aeon on Sept 1, 2005 7:38:29 GMT -5
Do you have any sources I could study further? Like I said, in our history books, Särkland is Constantinople. This is a first for me. I do not believe it. You must be mistaken. Constantinople is Miklagard. In Old Norse, Sarkland refers to the Muslim world. It is believed to derive from the same root as "Saracens". en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Särkland
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Post by MC anunnaki on Sept 1, 2005 7:41:15 GMT -5
It could very well be the fault of my history teachers. They always said "Särkland" and our books only mentioned Constantinople (and sometimes Vinland in North America). That's why it comes as a surprise to me know (I'm not very interested in Viking history so I haven't bothered to look it up further until now).
Anyway, do you have some info on blacks in Northern Europe in pre-Christian times? And I'm still eager to know what makes you think most Arabs were gay/bisexual. Do you think it's the same in modern times and do you consider it a genetic "trait" or a result of culture/religion/something else? Does this only apply to Arab men? I don't know the frequency of homosexuality in men and women, if it's the almost the same or not. Have you read some historical texts or something of the like that has given this indication? Perhaps you could link to some?
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