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Post by Igu on Feb 8, 2005 14:31:50 GMT -5
Sub-Saharan Africa will always be poor ; however, redrawing borders to minimize tribal conflicts and installing pro-capitalist 'benevolent dictators' can go a long way in making it less poor. These solutions are probably currently considered politically incorrect, unfortunately. That's exactly what I think, all of this PC comes from the guilt feeling of westeners about their past, they are destroying themeselves and their ex-colonies, only east-asians are safe. they deserve to rule the world.
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Post by nordicyouth on Feb 8, 2005 14:34:41 GMT -5
Africa's problems are due mostly to Western medicine and the 'Green' biotechnological revolution of the 1960s. Its colonizers were not very 'benevolent' but they certainly left Africa with the same structures they left in East Asia. In 1950, South Korea and Ghana (I believe) were almost identical economies - 50 years later, the same cannot be said.
Anyone who has trouble with the concept that doctors and nutritionists are more to blame for Third World population issues than Western political and economic 'domination,' I turn your attention to Paul M. Kennedy's 'The Rise And Fall Of The Great Powers,' and 'Preparing For The 21st Century.' Never had I read historical (socio-economic and political) books more compelling and trustworthy.
They really are the final word on why human civilization is where it is today.
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Post by nordicyouth on Feb 8, 2005 14:36:17 GMT -5
Kame: are you factoring out AID's in Botswana's population life-expectancy figures? This sounds reminiscent of the mayor of Washington - 'Outside of the killings, we have one of the lowest crime rates in the country.'
ROFL
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Post by Igu on Feb 8, 2005 14:49:59 GMT -5
Africa's problems are due mostly to Western medicine and the 'Green' biotechnological revolution of the 1960s. Its colonizers were not very 'benevolent' but they certainly left Africa with the same structures they left in East Asia. In 1950, South Korea and Ghana (I believe) were almost identical economies - 50 years later, the same cannot be said. Anyone who has trouble with the concept that doctors and nutritionists are more to blame for Third World population issues than Western political and economic 'domination,' I turn your attention to Paul M. Kennedy's 'The Rise And Fall Of The Great Powers,' and 'Preparing For The 21st Century.' Never had I read historical (socio-economic and political) books more compelling and trustworthy. They really are the final word on why human civilization is where it is today. -I think that the increase of the demographic rate in africa has a bad effect at medium term, but a good one at long term. thanks to their high rate of reproduction they will 'evolve' genitically faster than the rest of the world, in 500 years SS-Africans will be genitically immunized against AIDS and strongest phisically. -You can't compare korea with black africa, koreans are a people unto themeselves, they had a long history of an organized and structurized society. SS-africans never knew nation-states.
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Post by eufrenio on Feb 8, 2005 14:53:43 GMT -5
I agree with Igu: let them solve their own problems! That´s what independence is all about. I say, let them sink or swim!
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Berter
New Member
Et si on fait un tour ensemble, Nouna!?
Posts: 6
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Post by Berter on Feb 8, 2005 15:04:57 GMT -5
Eh...who are the 'good quality humans' in Morocco and Tunisia ? Moroccan and tunisian jews!. They are our 'hidden' leaders.
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Post by alexandrian on Feb 8, 2005 18:19:38 GMT -5
(egypt does not have a good quality of humans). Which is exactly why most people in Europe care far more about Egypt and regard Morroccans and Tunisians as ignorant immigrants. That's why the Arab League is centered in Cairo and that's why we are brokering peace deals. That's why we built the pyramids. That's why it is an Egyptian company that owns the telecom rights to "great" Tunisia. Because we're not good quality people? What the hell is that supposed to mean?
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Post by Solomon on Feb 8, 2005 18:40:05 GMT -5
Which is exactly why most people in Europe care far more about Egypt and regard Morroccans and Tunisians as ignorant immigrants. That's why the Arab League is centered in Cairo and that's why we are brokering peace deals. That's why we built the pyramids. That's why it is an Egyptian company that owns the telecom rights to "great" Tunisia. Because we're not good quality people? What the hell is that supposed to mean? Relax, man. If a certain member of this forum is any indication, well... Kidding, my friend.
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Post by eufrenio on Feb 9, 2005 17:53:01 GMT -5
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Post by Melnorme on Feb 9, 2005 18:03:13 GMT -5
Ah, but the truth is that almost any given Sub-Saharan African nation would probably be far easier to 'democratize', with an Iraq-style invasion, than Iraq itself. At least, it seems that way, if you look at the behavior of black minorities in the West : despite their tendencies towards criminality, they do tend to assimilate culturally fairly well, compared to others.
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Post by eufrenio on Feb 9, 2005 18:26:48 GMT -5
Ah, but the truth is that almost any given Sub-Saharan African nation would probably be far easier to 'democratize', with an Iraq-style invasion, than Iraq itself. Democracy is one thing; law and order another different thing altogether. You can have rule of law without democracy. The problem is , what happens to an African country as soon as a foreign ruler who established a semblance of order leaves? Im afraid we already know the answer. They assimilate to a certain degree, because they do not have a strong culture to identify with, unlike, say, the Chinese or Muslims. (Of course, many black Africans are muslim). I´m not quite sure they´re successful, muslim or not. Anyway, we´re looking at the performance of Africa, not at the performance of Africans abroad.
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Post by Melnorme on Feb 9, 2005 18:37:20 GMT -5
Democracy is one thing, law and order another. The problem is , what happens to an African country as soon as a foreign ruler who established a semblance of order leaves? Im afraid we already know the answer. Always more demands! I'm not seriously suggesting 'nation-building' in black Africa, but I do think it could improve the peoples' lives, far more than it currently is in the Middle East.
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Post by eufrenio on Feb 9, 2005 18:46:55 GMT -5
I don´t think the West has any moral obligation to help Africa. We did all we could. It´s best to let them sort their own problems. No more colonial rule? Fine, no more assistance: it´s as simple as that. They´re on their own.
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Kame
Full Member
Posts: 122
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Post by Kame on Feb 9, 2005 22:30:16 GMT -5
Awwww man. There we go with the stereotypes again. Frankly, to beleive that africans are somehow predisposed to crime is absurd, and worthy of hysterical laughter, stormfront jr.
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Post by alexandrian on Feb 9, 2005 23:35:20 GMT -5
Awwww man. There we go with the stereotypes again. Frankly, to beleive that africans are somehow predisposed to crime is absurd, and worthy of hysterical laughter, stormfront jr. Are you seriously going to deny the high per-capita incidences of crime among young blacks and Hispanics? Are you going to tell me that more crime is committed by whites than blacks?
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