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Post by santana on Mar 15, 2005 0:06:17 GMT -5
There is genetic evidence against the afrocentristic view
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Post by alexandrian on Mar 15, 2005 1:02:21 GMT -5
There is genetic evidence against the afrocentristic view Of course there is...pages and pages of it
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Post by alexandrian on Mar 15, 2005 1:03:29 GMT -5
An excellent refutation of Afrocentric myth.
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Post by topdog on Mar 15, 2005 1:11:00 GMT -5
An excellent refutation of Afrocentric myth. Have you read the information on thats site? I've read it and the author in essence refutes nothing. I can post a quote from one if his studies and show you how he misinterprets evidence. But of course, I'd just be wasting my time because you perceive thing in such simplistic ways such 'Afrocentrist' Nordicist and so forth, talking to you would be like talking to a brick wall.
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Post by topdog on Mar 15, 2005 1:13:12 GMT -5
Of course there is...pages and pages of it Instead of baiting, post your pages and pages. Not everyone who holds a position different to yours is an Afrocentrist, thats precisely why I refuse to debate this topic with people here anymore.
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Post by topdog on Mar 15, 2005 1:16:09 GMT -5
I agree with this. It's the most likely conclusion. I posted evidence for this earlier in this thread but I guess you were either too blind to read it or you just totally ignored it. Both Early Egypt and Nubia had far more in common that Egypt had with Palestine and Southern Europe. The roots of Egyptian civilization lie in the south.
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Post by topdog on Mar 15, 2005 1:16:54 GMT -5
deleted
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Post by alexandrian on Mar 15, 2005 1:58:15 GMT -5
I posted evidence for this earlier in this thread but I guess you were either too blind to read it or you just totally ignored it. Both Early Egypt and Nubia had far more in common that Egypt had with Palestine and Southern Europe. The roots of Egyptian civilization lie in the south. Of course, but this was because Egypt influenced Nubia. There is no evidence to suggest it happened the other way around. Nubia was Egypt's sole black AFrican trading partner, all its other chief allies and political/economic partners were either Berber, Middle Eastern, or Mediterranean European.
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Post by alexandrian on Mar 15, 2005 1:59:16 GMT -5
Have you read the information on thats site? I've read it and the author in essence refutes nothing. I can post a quote from one if his studies and show you how he misinterprets evidence. But of course, I'd just be wasting my time because you perceive thing in such simplistic ways such 'Afrocentrist' Nordicist and so forth, talking to you would be like talking to a brick wall. it cites infinitely more credible sources than any Afrocentrist site I've seen. Moreover, why don't you post the link to prove it wrong. AFrocentrists misinterpret everything, most notably the Herodotus quote that sparked the whole movement.
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Post by alexandrian on Mar 15, 2005 2:01:13 GMT -5
Instead of baiting, post your pages and pages. Not everyone who holds a position different to yours is an Afrocentrist, thats precisely why I refuse to debate this topic with people here anymore. If you look throughout this thread you will see numerous instances of analytical evidence, pictorial evidence, and evidence from Greco-Roman accounts. Furthermore, throughout this forum there are numerous links to sites and reports that show that "Egypt and Libya are closest to Europeans of the five North AFrican populations" and that Egyptians "have close connections with Morroccan Berbers". There are others that show extremely limited Negroid involvement in Egypt. I'll post all the links someday, knowing that you'll make an excuse not to listen. It's narrow-minded people like you that make me hate arguing over this.
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Post by santana on Mar 15, 2005 2:01:38 GMT -5
Alexandrian its soo not worth arguing anymore because even if a pharaoh or average ancient egyptian came back to life and told us face to face that AE wasnt black they still wouldnt believe.. khalas
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Post by topdog on Mar 15, 2005 3:11:51 GMT -5
Alexandrian its soo not worth arguing anymore because even if a pharaoh or average ancient egyptian came back to life and told us face to face that AE wasnt black they still wouldnt believe.. khalas If a Pharaoh did come back he would never call himself 'Caucasian' either.
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Post by Shenuda on Mar 15, 2005 6:58:02 GMT -5
This is stupid thread.
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Post by alexandrian on Mar 15, 2005 17:51:31 GMT -5
If a Pharaoh did come back he would never call himself 'Caucasian' either. He'd laugh his ass off if he found out people were trying to make a connection between him and West Africans he didn't even know existed.
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Post by shango on Mar 15, 2005 17:54:30 GMT -5
Rock art clue to nomad ancestors of Egyptian pyramid builders
Stone age cattle herders left religious imagery which was to re-emerge in Valley of Kings
C:\My Documents\Guardian Unlimited The Guardian Rock art clue to nomad ancestors of Egyptian pyramid builders.htm
Tim Radford, science editor Saturday April 5, 2003 The Guardian
History revealed: Saharan rock art suggests the Egyptian civilisation developed from nomads who settled
Rock art etched on cliff walls in the eastern Sahara more than 6,000 years ago could spell out the answer to one of archaeology's great puzzles - where the ancient Egyptians came from. The answer? They were there all the time.
The pyramid builders made their first entry in the archaeological record 5,000 years ago. This appearance was so abrupt that it has provoked fantasies of alien landings, mysterious civilisations or an invading master race. But in Genesis of the Pharaohs, published on Monday by Thames and Hudson, the Cambridge Egyptologist Toby Wilkinson presents a different picture.
The people who carved the great temples of Memphis and the elaborate tombs of the Valley of the Kings were once stone-age nomadic cattle herders who every summer, when the Nile flooded, took their herds to the fresh grass of the uplands.
They left a painstaking record of religious imagery, much of it to reappear 2,500 years later in the Valley of the Kings.
The origins of the Nile civilisation have been a hot topic for many decades. "They don't seem to have an ancestry, they don't seem to have any period of development, they just seem almost to appear overnight," said Dr Wilkinson.
"This has left people pondering, and of course it has been fertile ground for the unorthodox who suggest it was all planted by aliens, or visitors from Atlantis."
He and colleagues followed research by a German scholar, Hans Winkler, who before his death in the second world war published one preliminary report on rock art in what is now desert between the Red Sea and the Nile.
"It was never clear from his work whether what he found was all there was, or whether there was much, much more. The answer is there is a huge amount more, the place is littered with Egyptian rock art.
"There are some sites where the tableaux covered by the art are enormous - high cliff faces - and one has to imagine that these are the temples of prehistoric Egypt, these are sacred places to which people came back on a regular basis."
Dr Wilkinson's survey pinpointed hundreds of sites at which, 1,000 years before the founding of ancient Egypt, cattle herders had left intricate carvings of hippos and crocodiles, cattle, and above all, boats carrying godlike figures.
Each had been painstakingly "pecked" into the rock by an artist with a stone stylus. There are no written records. There is almost no other evidence of the people who fashioned the stories in the rock.
But the carvings tell of seasonal nomads who would have left the river valley with the annual flooding, and taken their herds to what had once been grassland savannah.
"I think one of the most striking things is the shape of the boat, with an upright prow and an incurved, sickle-shaped stern, very distinctive in the rock art.
"It is found throughout Egyptian history, and particularly in the Valley of the Kings, where it is quite specifically a divine boat, a boat associated with the king's voyage in the afterlife. I feel strongly that this particular shape of boat, already, in 4000BC, is associated with the spiritual dimension."
Some motifs in the desert stone explain other Egyptian puzzles. "On the coffin of Tutankhamun, there is the king, holding across his chest symbols of kingship which people have never thought about - and these are symbols of animal husbandry. Why does the king wear a bull's tail, why does he carry a crook?"
Useful link Thames and Hudson
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