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Post by DeLacroix on Dec 8, 2005 13:15:58 GMT -5
......... Israel should be moved to Europe
TEHRAN (AFP) - Iran's hardline President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said that if Germany and Austria feel responsible for massacring Jews during World War II, a state of Israel should be established on their soil.
Ahmadinejad, who sparked an international outcry in October when he said Israel "must be wiped off the map", also repeated his view Thursday that the Jewish state was a "tumour".
"Now that you believe the Jews were oppressed, why should the Palestinian Muslims have to pay the price?" the hardline president asked in an interview with Iran's Arabic-language satellite channel, Al-Alam.
"Why did you come to give a piece of Islamic land and the territory of the Palestinian people to them?
"You oppressed them, so give a part of Europe to the Zionist regime so they can establish any government they want. We would support it," he said, according to a transcript of his original Farsi-language comments given to AFP.
"So, Germany and Austria, come and give one, two or any number of your provinces to the Zionist regime so they can create a country there which all of Europe will support and the problem will be solved at its root," he said.
"Why do they insist on imposing themselves on other powers and creating a tumour so there is always tension and conflict?"
Al-Alam said Ahmadinejad was speaking in the holy city of Mecca in Saudi Arabia where he was attending a two-day meeting of the Organisation of the Islamic Conference that opened Wednesday.
"Is it not true that European countries insist that they committed a Jewish genocide? They say that Hitler burned millions of Jews in furnaces ... and exiled them," Ahmadinejad told Al-Alam.
"Then because the Jews have been oppressed during the Second World War, therefore they (the Europeans) have to support the occupying regime of Qods (Jerusalem). We do not accept this," he said.
He also noted that European countries "believe in this so much and are so determined that any researcher who denies it (the Holocaust) with historical evidence is dealt with in a most harsh way and sent to prison."
The Holocaust was Nazi Germany's systematic slaughter of an estimated six million Jews between 1933 and 1945, mainly in the latter years of World War II.
Official Iranian media frequently carry sympathetic interviews with Holocaust revisionist historians -- who attempt to establish that the number of Jews killed by the Nazis was wildly exaggerated.
Iran refuses to recognise Israel.
Ahmadinejad said his second proposal was for "a referendum in Palestine for all the original Palestinians" to decide on the future of what is now Israel, the Gaza Strip and West Bank.
But the president said that "the best solution is resistance so that the enemies of the Palestinians accept the reality and the right of the Palestinian people to have land."
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Post by nordicyouth on Dec 8, 2005 15:55:32 GMT -5
I can understand their point of view. However, the Iranians are not Palestinians, in fact Iranians are very anti-Arab.
Irano-Israeli enmity is more than just ethnic (Persian vs. Jew), but it is religious (Muslim vs. Jew).
Iran, more than any other country is a supporter of terrorism, donating funding and logistics support (training camps, etc.) to various organizations battling Israel and the West, esp. the United States.
With the Jewish State comes Western interests and influence, attention that Iran wants removed from the Persian Gulf.
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Post by Yankel on Dec 8, 2005 20:18:57 GMT -5
Exactly. Their motives are also political and religious. Note how Ahmadinejad specifically mentions the Palestinian Muslims but ignores the Christians.
You gotta love this jackass, though. He threatens the Jewish state even as we prepare to give the Palestinians their second country. This proves what Kahanists have been saying for years; they'll never be content. At least Europe is coming around.
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Post by DeLacroix on Dec 8, 2005 21:12:35 GMT -5
Exactly. Their motives are also political and religious. Note how Ahmadinejad specifically mentions the Palestinian Muslims but ignores the Christians. You gotta love this jackass, though. He threatens the Jewish state even as we prepare to give the Palestinians their second country. This proves what Kahanists have been saying for years; they'll never be content. At least Europe is coming around. Palestinians have already a state, Jordan. Palestine simply doesn't and shouldn't exist. And I think Israel, should kick that thug's ass, to teach him how to shut his trap.
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Post by dukeofpain on Dec 8, 2005 23:35:31 GMT -5
I can understand their point of view. However, the Iranians are not Palestinians, in fact Iranians are very anti-Arab. Irano-Israeli enmity is more than just ethnic (Persian vs. Jew), but it is religious (Muslim vs. Jew). Iran, more than any other country is a supporter of terrorism, donating funding and logistics support (training camps, etc.) to various organizations battling Israel and the West, esp. the United States. With the Jewish State comes Western interests and influence, attention that Iran wants removed from the Persian Gulf. Iranians aren't anti-Arab. They're Muslims, Arabs are Muslim, they support their Muslim friends and neighbors. Should they support Jews from America and Europe since these Jews are more deserving than the natives? The thing he doesn't understand is that the Germans didn't have a choice in feeling responsible, nor did they have the choice regarding the billions that they have supported the Jewish state with. If the Jewry wanted a chunk of Germany they could've gotten it, no questions asked. Israel and unlimited resources in building it, at the behest of Germany-America, of course was more savory. They could've just as easily set up a Jewish state in any number of places. In east Russia they have a "Jewish autonomous oblast" that hasn't cause ethnic strife, or other examples like the Pale of settlement, that came in wake of Jews refusing to homogenize into the Russian community. After all, they were living in Russia! The Zionist used the war and the subsequent reparations from Germany to fund the creation on of an illegal state and legitimize the creation of an illegal state. Which is exactly what happened. It's strange. It's as if they're self-fulfilling prophesies, even though Zionism was largely a secular political movement. Like Operation Moses for example,when thousands of Ethiopian Jews were immigrated to Israel. This is how American Christians are duped into supporting Zionism. They actually swear by the belief that the apocalypse is imminent and that Jesus will appear in Israel, the Jews will all convert and Jesus will set up a great kingdom, where all non-believers will be damned to eternal hellfire, like the demonized Palestinian Arabs for instance.
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Post by anodyne on Dec 8, 2005 23:39:33 GMT -5
Shiites and Sunnis have a history of conflict. Which can also be seen as an Arab versus Persian conflict.
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Post by dukeofpain on Dec 8, 2005 23:46:20 GMT -5
I can understand their point of view. However, the Iranians are not Palestinians, in fact Iranians are very anti-Arab. Irano-Israeli enmity is more than just ethnic (Persian vs. Jew), but it is religious (Muslim vs. Jew). Iran, more than any other country is a supporter of terrorism, donating funding and logistics support (training camps, etc.) to various organizations battling Israel and the West, esp. the United States. With the Jewish State comes Western interests and influence, attention that Iran wants removed from the Persian Gulf. America is by far the greatest supporter of terrorism. Even to this day. However they call terrorist "rebels" and "freedom fighters" like the ones that killed hundreds of children in ossetia. Just like they supported Islamic terrorism in afghanistan, just like when they incited alabnians into kosovo (bosnia the sequel) I can't believe how American media can actually get people to swallow this utter garbage. What do you call someone who explodes a bomb and kills innocent people? - A terrorist. What do you call someone who drops a bomb from a plane and kills innocent people? - A brave American pilot. What do you call it when a Palestinian uses violence against the Jews who have illegally occupied his land? - A terrorist attack. What do you call it when an Israeli helicopter fires rockets at Palestinian youths armed with stones? - Self-defense. What do you call a weapon that can kill thousands of people? - A weapon of mass destruction. What do you call a weapon that killed 1.5 million Iraqis, including more than 500,000 children? - Sanctions What do you call an attack on the Pentagon, a military command and control center in the US? - A cowardly attack on American freedom and democracy. What do you call the destruction of an Afghan village by US bombs? - An attack on a Taliban military command and control center. What do you call it when American Whites advocate an exclusively White state and the expulsion of all non-Whites? - Racism. What do you call it when Israeli Jews advocate an exclusively Jewish state and the expulsion of all non-Jews? - Zionism. What is the name of the leader wrongly accused of trying to create an ethnically pure Greater Serbia? - Slobodan Milosevic, now on trial as a war criminal. What is the name of the leader trying to create an ethnically pure Greater Israel? - Ariel Sharon, a "man of peace" Which Middle East country (whose name begins with I) does not possess nuclear weapons, agreed to allow access to UN weapons inspectors, and has been occupied by the US? - Iraq. Which Middle East country (whose name begins with I) possesses nuclear weapons, refuses to allow access to International Atomic Energy Agency inspectors and receives around $5 billion p.a. in aid from the US? - Israel. What do you call it when innocent people are killed by those resisting a brutal occupation? - Terrorism. What do you call it when innocent people are killed by an occupying army? - Collateral damage.
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Post by Yankel on Dec 8, 2005 23:51:10 GMT -5
Palestinians have already a state, Jordan. Palestine simply doesn't and shouldn't exist. And I think Israel, should kick that thug's ass, to teach him how to shut his trap. I agree. I want to see the UN take decisive action this time.
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Post by dukeofpain on Dec 8, 2005 23:52:35 GMT -5
Shiites and Sunnis have a history of conflict. Which can also be seen as an Arab versus Persian conflict. No. Iraqi Sunni and Shiites are at odds. Not simply because of a religious denomination, but because of other stressors. Just like Catholics and Protestant were at odds in N Ireland, yet catholics and Protestants in America weren't.
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Post by dukeofpain on Dec 8, 2005 23:53:50 GMT -5
Palestinians have already a state, Jordan. Palestine simply doesn't and shouldn't exist. And I think Israel, should kick that thug's ass, to teach him how to shut his trap. I agree. I want to see the UN take decisive action this time. Just like Israel has acted to all resolutions passed by the UN.
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Post by dukeofpain on Dec 9, 2005 0:03:36 GMT -5
Exactly. Their motives are also political and religious. Note how Ahmadinejad specifically mentions the Palestinian Muslims but ignores the Christians. You gotta love this jackass, though. He threatens the Jewish state even as we prepare to give the Palestinians their second country. This proves what Kahanists have been saying for years; they'll never be content. At least Europe is coming around. Palestinians have already a state, Jordan. Palestine simply doesn't and shouldn't exist. And I think Israel, should kick that thug's ass, to teach him how to shut his trap. Russia wouldn't let that happen. If Israel attacks Iran pre-emtivly, russia will no doubt intervenve. Just like it nearly did in serbia. If Israel innitiated a nuclear attack on one of it's neigbours, Russia would vaporize the jewish state.
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Post by Drooperdoo on Dec 9, 2005 0:04:42 GMT -5
Dukeofpain, You said that there were no Catholic-Protestant stressors in America [in contradistinction to Northern Ireland]. Actually, there was massive conflict. The Ku Klux Klan had Catholics on its list of undesirables, leaguing them with blacks and Jews. After the Civil War depleted America of millions of young men, Congress opened up immigration to Eastern and Southern Europe. Millions of Catholics flooded into traditionally-Protestant America.
Read books and newspapers from the 1890s-1930s. There were massive anti-Catholics outbreaks. FDR was accused of padding his administration with Catholics to get Vatican money. The protestants trumped up the now-famous "separation-of-church-and-state" rhetoric to stem Catholic influence in America. Even as late as 1960, John F. Kennedy had to contend with anti-Catholic bigotry.
It's shocking to think about today, but Catholics encountered a massive backlash in the early 20th Century.
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Post by anodyne on Dec 9, 2005 0:05:35 GMT -5
It's not just Iraqi Sunnis. The conflict between Sunnis and Shiites goes back centuries. To the 7th century I believe. There's a whole violent history behind it. The Protestant/Catholic conflict doesn't come close to it considering it's, for the most part, dead and buried and was short lived in comparison.
The Scot- Irish and Irish Catholics used to battle out in the streets in the 19th century. The crack on the Liberty Bell was the consequence of one of these riots. Philadelphia had a larger Scot- Irish population but even in NYC there were Orange Lodges and when they attempted to celebrate their victory over the Catholics in Ireland blood was spilt on the streets of New York. The last sectarian riot, within the US, I can think of between these groups happened some time in the 1870s in NYC.
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Post by Yankel on Dec 9, 2005 0:20:33 GMT -5
Casualties are part of war. The difference is that American troops aren't targeting civilians. Bombs are mainly used to destroy terrorist hideouts and training camps.
That's never actually happened, so I wouldn't know what to call it.
Aptly so.
The last person to advocate that scenario was banned from the Knesset and labeled a terrorist.
What would you call an Arab Kahanist? There's a famous 'Israeli Palestinian' who supports the expulsion of all Arabs from the Jewish state.
No, you have it all wrong. Sharon is trying to create an ethnically pure state of Palestine, which is why he made sure to remove every Jew from Gaza before handing it over to the PA.
Israel did not sign the NPT, and therefore is not obligated to allow inspectors in.
The PA recieves more foreign (i.e. US) aid per capita than other other country in the world.
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Post by Yankel on Dec 9, 2005 0:22:15 GMT -5
Just like Israel has acted to all resolutions passed by the UN. Non-binding resolutions notwithstanding, Israel has been very cooperative with the UN. Many times UN resolutions are unjust, and the US has intervened on Israel's behalf.
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