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Post by Polako on Feb 10, 2006 9:56:31 GMT -5
Poland is a homogenous country, in the sense that there aren't great differences between regions. That's true both genetically and phenotypically. There isn't a big difference between the "original" Poles and those who migrated from the eastern territories after WWII. The main type everywhere is Czupkiewicz's Intermarine....in other words a rounder headed and rounder faced Nordid. This type is also often mixed with various UP strains that we would call Baltic, East Baltic, Alpine, Borreby. It's also commonly Dinaricised, resulting in a type that can easily be mistaken for Anglo-Saxon Nordic, or even Keltic. I am such a type and people often think I'm British. Alpines are more common in the southwest, while Baltic types are more often seen in the rest of the country. But that's about it. Pigmentation is pretty even everywhere, except that the Kaszubs in the north are really blond, while the Gorale in the south are rather brunet...which is to be expected as many have their origins in the Wlach groups that migrated from the Balkans. Here's a pic of a typical group of Poles. Interestingly, it appears that the older the person, the more rounder the features. There's one guy there who looks clearly Ladogan, or Uralic, or part Mongoloid, and you'll get that in Poland occasionally...just like anywhere else in northern Europe. www.sapsppoznan.pl/IMG_1953full.jpg
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Post by redbaron on Feb 10, 2006 10:31:05 GMT -5
hey Polako, can you point me to more Polish anthro. information? I'd be really interested in seeing photographic examples of those types. Thanks.
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Post by Polako on Feb 10, 2006 10:36:44 GMT -5
hey Polako, can you point me to more Polish anthro. information? I'd be really interested in seeing photographic examples of those types. Thanks. There isn't much on the net. You could always try www.slavanthro.org/forum but unless you're Slavic it'll be tough to get membership there.
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Post by redbaron on Feb 10, 2006 11:05:55 GMT -5
Oh, well. Thanks anyway.
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Post by Agrippa on Feb 10, 2006 14:08:26 GMT -5
What are those people? The percentage of Leptosomics, generally progressive types and Nordids in particular is too high for an average, I think if you would post workers they would hardly have the same average in most regions - social sieving involved here (!).
Still we can see some typical faces indeed and a wider variation with all Polish variants included.
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Post by Polako on Feb 11, 2006 0:52:48 GMT -5
What are those people? The percentage of Leptosomics, generally progressive types and Nordids in particular is too high for an average, I think if you would post workers they would hardly have the same average in most regions - social sieving involved here (!). Still we can see some typical faces indeed and a wider variation with all Polish variants included. They're students from a military academy in Poznan. But they probably come from all over the country. People like them are mostly lower-middle class and middle class. And often they have recent peasant heritage. So yeah, they are very tyical. They are certainly not the cream of the crop. Poles like that would be taller and more leptosomic on average. But you wouldn't find them at a military academy, rather at expensive business colleges. Here's another group from the same academy. A bit older this time. www.sapsppoznan.pl/IMG_1969full.jpg
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Post by Agrippa on Feb 11, 2006 10:18:02 GMT -5
The average looks still better than the average but even without age calibration the average wouldnt be exactly the same - Alpinoid is significantly stronger and some measurements dont change that much during age. Sure there could be even higher selections. Maybe you want to post a comparison if seeing if thats really the case...
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Post by huzar on Feb 11, 2006 14:19:29 GMT -5
What are those people? The percentage of Leptosomics, generally progressive types and Nordids in particular is too high for an average, I think if you would post workers they would hardly have the same average in most regions - social sieving involved here (!). Still we can see some typical faces indeed and a wider variation with all Polish variants included. They're students from a military academy in Poznan. But they probably come from all over the country. People like them are mostly lower-middle class and middle class. And often they have recent peasant heritage. So yeah, they are very tyical. They are certainly not the cream of the crop. Poles like that would be taller and more leptosomic on average. But you wouldn't find them at a military academy, rather at expensive business colleges. Here's another group from the same academy. A bit older this time. www.sapsppoznan.pl/IMG_1969full.jpgStrange. I imagined a lighter pigmentation for Poles, on average. The group isn't lighter than a group of yugoslavian or north-italian people.
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Post by quarryman on Feb 11, 2006 20:16:58 GMT -5
I think the pigmentation of Poles fit well comparing with neighbouring regions. Czechs and Slovaks are visibly more brunette, Scandinavians more blonde. The neighbours to the west (n Germans) and east (Lithuanians, Belarussians, nw Ukrainians) about the same.
The impression of pigmentation is also relative. In Scandinavia, people often can't tell Poles apart from other central Europeans or even ex-Yugos. Many describe Poles as "small, round and brunette". But if asking a Czech, he could describe a Pole as "slim, dirty blonde and long-nosed".
A little off-topic but related: Before there were immigrants from the Mideast in northern Europe, southern Europeans were often stereotypisized as "olive-skinned, black-haired and brown-eyed". But today not many people in the streets of Stockholm or Berlin would think of old-established immigrant groups as Serbs or Italians as especially different looking.
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Post by Polako on Feb 11, 2006 20:28:52 GMT -5
They're students from a military academy in Poznan. But they probably come from all over the country. People like them are mostly lower-middle class and middle class. And often they have recent peasant heritage. So yeah, they are very tyical. They are certainly not the cream of the crop. Poles like that would be taller and more leptosomic on average. But you wouldn't find them at a military academy, rather at expensive business colleges. Here's another group from the same academy. A bit older this time. www.sapsppoznan.pl/IMG_1969full.jpgStrange. I imagined a lighter pigmentation for Poles, on average. The group isn't lighter than a group of yugoslavian or north-italian people. Poles are much lighter than north Italians. I've been to north Italy, and the whole region strikes me as brunet in comparison to Poland and places like Slovenia.
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Post by One Humanity on Feb 11, 2006 23:34:42 GMT -5
Poles are much lighter than north Italians. I've been to north Italy, and the whole region strikes me as brunet in comparison to Poland and places like Slovenia. You always tell so much good about them.
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Post by Polako on Feb 12, 2006 3:22:00 GMT -5
Poles are much lighter than north Italians. I've been to north Italy, and the whole region strikes me as brunet in comparison to Poland and places like Slovenia. You always tell so much good about them. It depends how you look at it. Do you think accusing someone of being brunet is an insult? In any case, north Italians still look mostly Italian to me. Only some look Central European.
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Post by quarryman on Feb 12, 2006 8:01:20 GMT -5
I must agree with Polako that Slovenes in comparison look much lighter than most Italians.
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Post by huzar on Feb 12, 2006 8:25:56 GMT -5
[ Poles are much lighter than north Italians. I've been to north Italy, and the whole region strikes me as brunet in comparison to Poland and places like Slovenia. You perception is wrong. First of all northern italy has a notable percentage of southern italians immigrated. Native northern italian pop isn't darker than Slovania, for sure. I live here, and i visited many times Slovenia. I know very well the general somatic look. Northeastern italy, for example, share tha same % of Blondism and light eyes of Austria/Slovenia (Biasutti/Skerlj anthropologic data) Besides , when you say brunet, what you mean exactly ? black ? Dark brown ? Medium Brown ? Red brown ? clarify , and post an example, if you can please.
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Post by huzar on Feb 12, 2006 8:29:07 GMT -5
[ In any case, north Italians still look mostly Italian to me. Only some look Central European. You have to be blind Polako. Native northern italian ( i mean north form padanian plain) are definetely central europeans. At least not less than average Frenchmen or Swiss in the west, or Austria/slovenian in the east. That's sure. Indeed majority of N.Italians are Alpinid/Dinarid/Atlantid Nordid mix
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