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Post by Igu on Jul 18, 2005 14:44:49 GMT -5
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Post by Educate Me on Jul 18, 2005 16:21:40 GMT -5
Augustine was north african too
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Post by Melnorme on Jul 18, 2005 16:45:08 GMT -5
Igu : It seems to me that the ancient Roman presence in North Africa is truly a 'lost world'.
Tell me, are there any traces of it left in modern times? Place names? Famous archaelogical ruins? I'm guessing that traditions amongst actual living people would be too much to ask for.
For example in the Near East there are lots of Arab villages and other landmarks whose names are easily recognizable as distortions of Greek words.
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Post by iberomaurusian on Jul 18, 2005 17:31:57 GMT -5
I think that noone of those famous religious Imazighen of ancient Rome (Arus, Gelasius I, etc) were true Berbers. They most likely were roman residents in NWA. Imazighen and religion are mutually exclusive!  Igu : It seems to me that the ancient Roman presence in North Africa is truly a 'lost world'. Tell me, are there any traces of it left in modern times? Place names? Famous archaelogical ruins? I'm guessing that traditions amongst actual living people would be too much to ask for. For example in the Near East there are lots of Arab villages and other landmarks whose names are easily recognizable as distortions of Greek words. I think that the punic/roman presence in northwest africa wasnt that strong if compared with their presence in the ME. I can only answer the part of your question that is about place names: the northwest african toponomy is dominated by amazigh names (ex: Tahaddart, Tamallalt, ![]() , Tizi nteshka, Tizi wezou, etc) followed by arabic names (ex: Rabat, Eddarlbida (Casablanca)). The punic/roman toponomy is totally lost in the rural areas but is still recognisible in some ancient (historical) towns' names (ex: Tanger ( --Tengis), Cosantina (Constantine), Mogador, ![]() Walili (Volubilis)[/img], etc). Read that thread, Mel! Might be Igu has more info to add! |
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Post by Crimson Guard on Jul 18, 2005 19:42:27 GMT -5
I should form a Numidian Legion! ;D
Legio Africanus!
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Post by iberomaurusian on Jul 19, 2005 6:41:02 GMT -5
and Berter we know each other from Panf.info (as Med) Welcome Med!. Your style and beliefs are similar to mine, so prepare yourself: my enemies will be yours!. |
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Post by Igu on Jul 19, 2005 15:28:01 GMT -5
Igu : It seems to me that the ancient Roman presence in North Africa is truly a 'lost world'. Tell me, are there any traces of it left in modern times? Place names? Famous archaelogical ruins? I'm guessing that traditions amongst actual living people would be too much to ask for. For example in the Near East there are lots of Arab villages and other landmarks whose names are easily recognizable as distortions of Greek words. In Algeria; Eitheir the ruins are protected from visitors, or they are abandoned. Once I tried with some frineds to get into the tipaza's ruins but it was "closed". What can you expect from a socialist country? That is just a sample from the pics:  Help yourself: www.pbase.com/cyrilp/ruinesrom |
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Post by Educate Me on Jul 19, 2005 18:17:08 GMT -5
Why are they protected from Visitors? For the protection of the ruins or because the roman presence is seen as something bad?
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Post by iberomaurusian on Jul 20, 2005 6:17:45 GMT -5
Why are they protected from Visitors? For the protection of the ruins or because the roman presence is seen as something bad? Obviously for the protection of the ruins, Its a common practice worldwide, I guess: Egypt protects some pharoanic sites, France protects Lascaux caves, etc. Why would the romans presence in NA be seen as 'bad'!?  |
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Post by Educate Me on Jul 20, 2005 13:56:51 GMT -5
who knows, Igu said they are socialists, maybe they see the roman presence as evil capitalist occupation!
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Post by Crimson Guard on Jul 20, 2005 16:19:45 GMT -5
Socialist bastards....  I'am Sure Berter or Igu will explain that more clearly...but my speculative thinking is its probably has something to do with that the Roman occupation may represent 1)Christianity/Crusades 2) European Domination 3)Western Decandence.Also Islam may play a hand into this thinking.So to the Socialist Government (not the regular civilians) this probably doenst sit to well,so they want to cover up/repress the past. I went to school with kid from Tunis...for some reason he thought that he(and all Tunisians) where related to Italians...He brought up mainly the Roman Times.That sparked my interested in how exaclty North Africans(from Mauritania in the West to Egypt in the East)view Ancient Rome. |
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Post by iberomaurusian on Jul 21, 2005 9:32:24 GMT -5
who knows, Igu said they are socialists, maybe they see the roman presence as evil capitalist occupation! Why would they think so while they have a more recent one: the very long french capitalist occupation (1830 - 1962)!?. Plus, I never heard of Romans being called capitalists; They sure had a capitalist way of life and economy but they were not aware of it.  |
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Post by iberomaurusian on Jul 21, 2005 9:58:06 GMT -5
Socialist bastards.... I'am Sure Berter or Igu will explain that more clearly... Oh, GrimsonGuard! you and Educate Me have gone far from the right (and evident) answer: some historical sites or monuments are in such an altered stage that the only way to ensure their protection is to forebide their visit. I'm certain that all the NA roman monuments have the status of national heritage in their respective countries. Plus, young people over here are correctly informed through history books about the european presence (Roman, Vandal, Portuguese, Spanish and French) in NA. |
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Post by Crimson Guard on Jul 21, 2005 10:38:31 GMT -5
OK thanks for the clear up! I guess Igu made it sound like some kindve Socialist repression,well they are known for doing things like that in Europe atleast. Berter,you have -18,I gave you an exalt the other day and that left you with -15...Wonder who has it in for you.  |
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Post by iberomaurusian on Jul 21, 2005 13:15:54 GMT -5
Berter,you have -18,I gave you an exalt the other day and that left you with -15...Wonder who has it in for you. I have been smited twice after posting here. Some people do not appreciate my non-PC posts. |
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