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Post by santana on Feb 21, 2005 1:38:20 GMT -5
REcently they did DNA TESTS to see as to whether or not modern egyptian matched the genes of ancient egyptians and the tests were positive..secondly.. they did a test to compare J1 HAPLOTYPES etc.. to see whether or not egyptians were closer to sub saharan africans or middle easterners..there was A HUGE similarity between egyptians and asians then with sub saharan africans.. im sorry dude... there have been so many posts on this site about thsi with so many diagrams and charts PROVING that egyptians are not and were not black.. i go with teh numbers not with pictures who mite for all we know have been drawn by sub saharan african invaders trying to claim the egyptian race..
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Post by imhotep06 on Feb 21, 2005 1:41:44 GMT -5
From your response I can tell that you have no knowledge on genetics or know the history of human development and migration. For the latest in genetic mapping, you must consult Dr. Spencer Wells. I suggest you review the data in his published work "Journey of Man: A Genetic Odyssey" From National Geographic: [By collecting blood samples from thousands of men living in isolated tribes around the world and analyzing their DNA, 34-year-old geneticist Spencer Wells and his colleagues discovered that all humans alive today can be traced back to a small tribe of hunter-gatherers who lived in Africa 60,000 years ago. Following this genetic trail, Wells has charted the ancient journey of our ancestors as they populated the planet, continent by continent. The story is told in the 2002 National Geographic documentary The Journey of Man: A Genetic Odyssey and the book of the same name.] ![](http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2002/12/photogalleries/journey_of_man/images/popup/jm2l.jpg) As can be seen from the map, life started in the central Laclustrine area of Africa and from there migration through the Nile Valley into Asia. Civilization and Knowledge came up through the Nile Valley and not vise versa. I don't know where you are getting your information from, but I can garauntee it is outdated and does not fall in line with the latest in genetic data. Cheikh Anta Diop already proved the African genetic make-up of the mummies in 1974. You are late. I suggest you read up some more and come back when you have thoroughly done some research. I gave you a reference in which to check the data. Like I said, you are not an Egyptian by blood. You are a result of foreign occupation and that's just how it is. Asar Imhotep www.mochasuite.com ur totally disregarding the depiction of white egyptian on their walls and the lighter representations of hte egyptians.. secondly... have u seen my face.. i have a picture.. i look typical egyptian... and i did a DNA test and my genes are extremely close to ancient egyptians so dont tell me that i am not egyptian... secondly i have absolutely nothing against black ppl and i have several black friends but thsi si ridiculous.. you say whatever you wanna say but no egyptian will ever EVER say that their civilization was black because it simply isnt backed by any DNA findings..dont give me pictures , give me DNA EVIDENCE
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Post by mike2 on Feb 21, 2005 1:44:07 GMT -5
I just think it's kind of sad that this issue is argued over so much. I never hear black Africans seriously talking about the kingdoms of Songhai or Mali or Ghana or Benin or Kanem-Bornu or what have you. It's always got to be about Egypt. Frankly, I'm tired of Egypt. If you want to discuss REAL black African Congoid civilizations, let's talk about Great Zimbabwe or the kingdom of Kongo. Leave Egypt to the Egyptians.
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Post by santana on Feb 21, 2005 1:44:35 GMT -5
what is your ethnicity..and what is ur fascination in egyptian history and ppl and why are u so determined to say its black
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Post by mike2 on Feb 21, 2005 1:48:37 GMT -5
Why is there such fascination with Egypt? Seriously, what's wrong with West African civilizations? I think they're pretty cool. ![](http://www.africanamericanbud.com/mm/images/107.jpg)
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Post by santana on Feb 21, 2005 1:50:15 GMT -5
there is nothing wrong with them... its just that you cant just take something that isnt true and say its true..
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Post by mike2 on Feb 21, 2005 3:34:07 GMT -5
Just because some of us (like myself) don't buy a black Egypt doesn't mean we are racist. There are many real black African civilizations that I respect just as much as I respect Egypt. There are also some imaginary black African civilizations that make my eyes roll. Let's take a look at them. The artwork I'm about to show you is from an Afrocentric website but is still amazing, I must admit, even if some of it is fantasy. IMAGINED BLACK AFRICAN/CONGOID CIVILIZATIONS:Egypt: Reign of Hatshepsut![](http://www.africanamericanbud.com/mm/images/125.jpg) If this representation of Hatshepsut is supposed to convince me the Egyptians were negroid, then I'm an Australian aborigine. Egypt: Reign of Thutmose![](http://www.africanamericanbud.com/mm/images/127.jpg) A pharaoh with negroid affinities is nothing unusual. All that does is prove that Congoid types were present in Egypt, something I don't think any of us would dispute. That still doesn't mean the majority of Egyptians were Congoid. And I doubt Thutmose was as West African-looking as this representation makes him out to be. Egypt: Reign of Amenhotep III![](http://www.africanamericanbud.com/mm/images/124.jpg) Queen Tiye had sub-Saharan Nubian origins. She was not representative of the Egyptian population. Whatever negroid character Tutankhamen had came from her. Egypt: Reign of Akhenaton and Nefertiti![](http://www.africanamericanbud.com/mm/images/112.jpg) Akhenaton might have had negroid blood but he was also deformed. Nefertiti was definitely not Congoid. Those who doubt the accuracy of her bust are conspiracy theorists who think the white man is out to deny the black man his grand civilization. What tripe. Egypt: Reign of King Rameses II![](http://www.africanamericanbud.com/mm/images/126.jpg) Ah... the beautiful Nefertari... the most Caucasoid Nubian I've ever seen. Once again, her Nubian heritage proves nothing about the average racial type of Egypt. Hellenistic Egypt![](http://www.africanamericanbud.com/mm/images/123.jpg) Black Cleopatra. Don't even get me started. Face it. The greater weight of anthropological, genetic, artistic, literary, and just plain common sense evidence simply does not support the idea of a predominantly Congoid Africa. A few black pharaohs and negroid representations does not prove the Egyptians were dramatically less Caucasoid than their Berber neighbors. Congoid is not synonymous with very dark skin. It's the facial features of the Congoid race that makes it what it is. To concede to the notion that the Egyptians were closely related to sub-Saharan Africans is to completely invalidate the parameters of the Congoid race. The word "Congoid" would be useless! Native Americans look very different from other Mongoloids but they still share the same basic skull shape as East Asians. Egyptian skulls are much closer to Berbers and other Atlanto-Mediterraneans than they are to any Congoid. And even if the Egyptians were Congoid, they certainly weren't West African. Regardless of what the real race of the people in question might have been, Afrocentric claims to Egypt are as ridiculous as Teutonic claims to Greece. Afrocentrism is a backlash against Eurocentrism and should be counted as little more than a propagandistic wet dream on the part of its creators and espousers, who are usually just as racist as the damnable Eurocentrists that preceded them. I respect that there were Congoids in Egypt. But to say the bulk of the population was Congoid is something I just refuse to accept without overwhelming evidence to the contrary. Carthage![](http://www.africanamericanbud.com/mm/images/135.jpg) Okay, I can understand why some might think Egypt has roots in black Africa... but Carthage?!?!?! Give me a break. Trying to black-a-vise Hannibal and the Carthaginians is just ridiculous. Just because a civilization was based in Africa does not mean it was Congoid. REAL BLACK AFRICAN/CONGOID CIVILIZATIONS:Kongo Medieval Songhai Late Songhai Mali Zululand, 18th Century Zululand, 19th Century Ethiopia... basically Congoid Ethiopian Sheba... basically Congoid Nubia Asante Basutoland Bornu Bechuanaland Bushongo Bissandugu Dahomey Matamba Zaria Medieval Ghana Ghana, Modern Opobo Tchokwe![](http://www.africanamericanbud.com/mm/images/131.jpg) And there are many more where that came from. I wonder if you've even heard of half of those civilizations. The Afrocentric fixation on Egypt is a crying shame when there are so many colorful, PROVEN black African civilizations out there.
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Post by alexandrian on Feb 21, 2005 13:07:26 GMT -5
I like it how the only representationof a black THutmose, Hannibal, or Nefertiti comes from a beer company. Face it, those drawings of Egyptian pharoahs are just as inaccurate as the drawing of Hannibal, they are based on nothing but the imagination and idiocy of the artist.
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Post by santana on Feb 21, 2005 14:29:11 GMT -5
exactgly.... if ancient egyptians were black..it would show on the modern egyptians...
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Post by mike2 on Feb 21, 2005 15:44:26 GMT -5
I like it how the only representationof a black THutmose, Hannibal, or Nefertiti comes from a beer company. Face it, those drawings of Egyptian pharoahs are just as inaccurate as the drawing of Hannibal, they are based on nothing but the imagination and idiocy of the artist. It's a shame, too, since many of the other drawings depicting true black African civilizations are very good. They shouldn't have been sullied by Afrocentric propaganda.
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Post by TheMostRoyalLady on Feb 22, 2005 16:09:14 GMT -5
You're right, it doesn't. It just means you're ignorant. But don't worry, there's still hope for you yet! Just because some of us (like myself) don't buy a black Egypt doesn't mean we are racist.
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Post by TheMostRoyalLady on Feb 22, 2005 16:11:22 GMT -5
Just like in the USA, the native americans presence is clearly present in modern Americans? ![::)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/eyesroll.png) exactgly.... if ancient egyptians were black..it would show on the modern egyptians...
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Post by mike2 on Feb 22, 2005 17:04:50 GMT -5
I'm ignorant for not buying into Afrocentric crap? ![:D](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/grin.png) Hey, if you don't like me, just go ahead and say it. "Mike the Hellene, I don't like you." In fact, I have a morbid tendency to enjoy it when people feel the compelling need to insult my character. I just hope to God you don't call all the people you disagree with ignorant without backing up your opinion first. Because you're not going to make too many new friends with that kind of attitude.
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Post by imhotep06 on Feb 22, 2005 17:35:22 GMT -5
This issue is argued so much because layman, not in the field, are still teaching outdated information and can't come to grasp with reality. No one is stuck on Ta-Merry. You still have individuals who believe that Ta-Merry is anything but an African nation in the most mundane sense of the word. Europeans are always lieing about some historic event. It is shameful. When the evidence of Astropolithicus, Homo Habilus and Homo Erectus and Homo sapiens (The oldest of the genus homo is now homo sapiens idaltu 160, 000 B.P.), they went to extreme lengths to take humanity out of Africa with wishful skemes. www.mochasuite.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1310&KW=homoDo I have to remind anyone who has studied about "Piltowndown Man" (Marcellin Boule and Henri-Victor Vallois, Les Hommes Fossiles, page 119)? Everytime evidence points to an African origin of anything, we get configurative reconstructions of remains such as the Ra-Hotep and Neforet bust that was already shown in the Pyramid Post. They make up stupid orientations such as "dark whites" as has the Massai been called because they have "straight noses.' And that the Great Zimbabwe temple complex was designed by Shipwrecked Europeans. Just plain stupidity. Humanity was already before Homer wrote the Illiad. That is Europe's first introduction to the world. Arab nations were just wanderers as they were named as such: Aamu. So called individuals, like the ones flooded on this board, are afraid to study. They don't study beyond figures with the paint scratched off or that were formed on "white" limestone. You have to look at genetics, linguistics, culture as well as the remains of the nation for a complete picture. And these people are too lazy to do that. Every serious scholar can attest to the African origin, culture of the Ta-Merrians. www.freemaninstitute.com/video/trailer.wmvIt is just time you people catch up and stop relying on your wishful thinking. Asar Imhotep www.mochasuite.com I just think it's kind of sad that this issue is argued over so much. I never hear black Africans seriously talking about the kingdoms of Songhai or Mali or Ghana or Benin or Kanem-Bornu or what have you. It's always got to be about Egypt. Frankly, I'm tired of Egypt. If you want to discuss REAL black African Congoid civilizations, let's talk about Great Zimbabwe or the kingdom of Kongo. Leave Egypt to the Egyptians.
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Post by alexandrian on Feb 22, 2005 18:19:30 GMT -5
Leave Egypt to the Egyptians. AMEN!
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