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Post by hs on Jun 20, 2005 10:27:18 GMT -5
So he was a Lombard. That doesn't mean he knows anything about Lombards. He probably didn't know who his grandparents were let alone some Germanic tribe he was allegedly attached to. I don't believe you or your references. Anyone can lump Germanic speakers with Scandinavia without any proof because that is where you Nordic obsessed people think all Germans come from. Sorry, Tacitus said long before some priestling that the Lombards came from the lower Elbe valley. People's traditions of their origins are often wrong, made up. The oldest writings on the Lombards do not mention Scandinavia. And if they came form there why do the Lombards think it was an island? Only a rabid Nordicist would care about the origin point of an extinct people who incidentally only left Germany because of the Huns even after they allied themselves with them and intermarried with them. I am sure the priestling did not mention the Hunnic association or the intermarriage with them. I would rather accept Tacitus over some fool centuries later. You Pannonists are really insane. Im not a Pannonist or whatever (if you were as intelligent as you say - and proclaim wild and aloud -youd already have guessed what my nick means and from there which is the identity i embrace). Again, as I had said, Tacitus identified the Lombards as one of the four Suebi Tribes. Interestingly, the Romans called the Baltic Sea "Mare Suebicum". I know about the lower Elbe valley reference, but the ultimate origins are always directed to Scandinavia. I didnt know looking for the Lombards origins would provoke such an outburst of rage and anger... From now on Ill be more careful with the literature I post here.
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Post by hs on Jun 20, 2005 10:28:52 GMT -5
I couldn't care less for any particular part of Europe. I happen to be Swiss but my family derives from NW Italy and I think the Lombard thing is overdone. The Lombards won't make Italians any Whiter. They are still predominantly Dinarid, Med and Alpinid combinations and on the dark side of European pigmentation. Look Berbers can claim genuine Scandinavian Germanic origin through the Vandals probably of more genuineness than any Italians can claim the Lombards. okay... i dont care for any particular part of Europe or the world either.
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Post by nockwasright on Jun 20, 2005 10:47:34 GMT -5
youd already have guessed what my nick means and from there which is the identity i embrace). Shouldn't it be hss? However the literature on Lombards was interesting. It is dubious though that the Lombards left a meaningful genetic legacy on Northern Italy, due to their relative scarce number. Anyone who has seen Northern Italy however knows that North Eastern Italians bear no resemblance to Scandinavians; more to Germans or Slovenians.
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Post by Platypus on Jun 20, 2005 10:59:26 GMT -5
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Post by Ponto Hardbottle on Jun 20, 2005 11:34:26 GMT -5
Why is he so brown skinned? He looks like an Italian dinarid. Not unusual. hs stands for horse shit. He obviously has something stuck up his ass about the Lombards an extinct people of dubious racial origin. It is interesting that in graves that were found to be Lombard that the occupants were skeletally more like mongoloids than caucasoids. A legacy of their close and intimate association with the Huns. The Romans would never have been to the Baltic or known of any Baltic peoples, come on, get real. Lots of froth but no substance. The Suebii were a south-west German tribe with nothing to do with Scandinavia but more with Gaulish tribes like the Helvetti. I am Swiss boyo, you can't tell me what Germanic speaking tribes are German or which came from Scandinavia during the folkwandering caused by adverse climatic conditions in the North lands. There is a big difference between Germans and Germanic tribes.
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Post by Crimson Guard on Jun 20, 2005 11:58:25 GMT -5
No Bert, that went for posters like you(obviously it set off a button,good) Your a wanna-be German(ic) and a disgrace to Italy and in general.You give good and real and honest Germans a bad rep...I'am not going to waste my time talking to a little twit like you, when I can be doing something more dangerious like re-arranging my sock draws. Enough with you loser!
I will say this:
The Lombards and the other German tribes left no genetic trace in Italy.Also it should be pointed out that these tribes where few in number when they finally took control of Italy,most went back to germany and other parts of central europe and those that stayed became completly Italiaized by adopting Italian names,langauage and culture very quickly. In fact they mostly left Italians in ruling postions,as they sucked in administrative affairs.
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Post by hs on Jun 20, 2005 12:13:09 GMT -5
hs stands for horse shit. He obviously has something stuck up his ass about the Lombards an extinct people of dubious racial origin]. What drove me to post Garibaldi and then some of the literature Ive read on the Lombards is that the Italians are being portrayed as uniformly dark haired dark eyed brown skinned people, which is not the case. Italy is no less Germanic, in a way, than England. There were not only Lombards, but Ostrogoths, Vandals, etc, in Italy(for centuries). There were Kelts in Italy. Romans. Italy is far too complex to be reduced by simplified stereotypes. Thats it. To me, Garibaldi would fit better in Scandinavia than in North Africa, Greece, Rome or as a round headed Southern German (funnily his family name is Lombard). Thats my opinion. No reason to get crazy about it... otherwise you should get into therapy. I was only digging up the homeland of the Lombards, and thus showing the complexity of Italys anthropological panorama.
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Post by bert on Jun 20, 2005 13:03:12 GMT -5
No Bert, that went for posters like you(obviously it set off a button,good) Your a wanna-be German(ic) and a disgrace to Italy and in general.You give good and real and honest Germans a bad rep...I'am not going to waste my time talking to a little twit like you, when I can be doing something more dangerious like re-arranging my sock draws. Enough with you loser!
I will say this:
The Lombards and the other German tribes left no genetic trace in Italy.Also it should be pointed out that these tribes where few in number when they finally took control of Italy,most went back to germany and other parts of central europe and those that stayed became completly Italiaized by adopting Italian names,langauage and culture very quickly. In fact they mostly left Italians in ruling postions,as they sucked in administrative affairs. ...........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................Hey Crimson , I could find ten thousand elaborated different ways to offend you , but I' m sure you won' t understand any of them so I carefully avoid to do that . With regards to the ''wannabe germanic'' , this is exactly what can be expected from guys like you that are used to see till the end of their nose . But if you look a bit further , you would see that a lot of information has been passed by myself to this argument as well as by hs , useful information for all except for those like you . Everyone that stayed here where I live left something Mr King Crimson . And when I say everyone , I mean everyone , Mr Moronic . It happens that a lot of these guys have been found buried , with their weapons and horses , four kilometers far from my home . It happens that they were all a bit too tall to be mongols , dear Mr I know everything . It happens that they were few in a land that was desolated at that time Mr what I say is true . It happens that a lot of castles in this north eastern part were built by them , that didn' t extinct but mixed together with the rest of the people living here . So when you talk of extinct peoples or huns or whatever comes from your mouth , please take care to not offend those that have just a little more brain than what you have ( you have ? )
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Post by Ponto Hardbottle on Jun 20, 2005 23:35:19 GMT -5
Sorry, Garibaldi does not look German or Scandinavian. Greek, Serb, Croat or Albanian perhaps. He is too dinaricized. The dark brown to black hair, the mid to dark brown eyes and the non florid, yellowish tone white skin are not stereotypes in Italy. England is on a scale out of ten, about 7 Germanic, Italy is about 1. You can't really be serious. I lived in England for 10 years and I am telling you even the so called dark haired English person, still looks Northern compared to a light haired Italian. Northern and Southern Europeans differ in other physical features like head shape, stature, body proportions than just the blond/black thing. In fact you could cut off their hair, cover their eyes with white contacts and powder their faces white, and the Northerners will still be distinguishable from the Southerners.
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Post by bert on Jun 21, 2005 4:06:28 GMT -5
Beyond the ridiculous imo , what you are saying ponto . Skin tone as well as blondism varies linearly with latitude . With regards to skin tone a very reliable source I found published a chart with different colours showing variations of skin tones in europe . Given that italy is uniform as it can be expected by guys like you , for a country thin and long that covers 1000 km or more in latitude , the chart displayed the same colour , i.e. skin tone , for north italy and southern to south-central france , and another colour for southern italy , almost the whole spain , greece . Then , the central argument is not that northern italians are similar to actual germans . Never said such an idiocy . But another very large idiocy is thinking that a people coming from extreme north ( Mr Ponto the romans were used to call scandinavia ''vagina gentium'' ) , the lombards , settled here and then went back . Historic literature says the contrary . They settled here , went intermarried and the final result is actual northern italy . A cocktail between kelts , etruscans , romans , germans . And even though blondism is recessive and the pink tune of white too , face traits are not Mr Ponto , so it is expectable that those lombards left some kind of faces all around here . I see millions people from germany , holland , england every year . Why don' t you ask me why I can easily recognize with 90 % accuracy a southern italian from a northern one , an english from anyone else , but not a german from a dutch , or norwegian or swedish ? Just because the differences between them are the same differences between one that is tall 1.75 and another one who is 1.80 , both belonging to the same people . Even if the swedes may have their skulls one centimeter longer . This with regards to the fact that swedes and germans are completely different as you say and perhaps the most swedish place on earth is congo , but not the central one , the eastern one . A last remark , the guy in picture is not dark , just tanned in a photograph perhaps dark . The guy is blue eyed and 1.90 cm tall , from Bergamo , but perhaps this guy uses coloured lenses , he depicts his skin of white , but just in winter and with regards to height he makes himself stretched by a machine . Otherwise he could have the non stereotypical carachteristics said before by the Isaac Newton of antropology . And given that the english people are 70% germanic ( tell me who pass you this percentages so precise ) I would ask you why a month ago I saw at the Garda Lake , a community of English boys and girls , perhaps 50 persons , staying here in holiday with traits that confounded them with local people both for colour and faces . They were english , real english , but not properly germanic by aspect .
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Post by Platypus on Jun 21, 2005 6:11:35 GMT -5
Lake Garda!!! Sounds like you live in a nice place Bert. your a wannabe Celtic/Lombard, but I'm gonna back u up, since apparently there are indeed, especially in Lombardy, but also in Tuscany many nordic looking individuals, though they amount less than the main Alpine, Dinaric and Mediterraneans combinations. Milanese Girl: img249.echo.cx/img249/6299/milan3tv.jpgMaybe the Anglo's you saw were of Keltic derivation rather than Anglo Saxon or Viking. In East Anglia, which is in the east of England and the area first invaded by Anglo Saxons, some shepered -Dog trainers still use old british words of Keltic derivation to give orders to their dogs.
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Post by bert on Jun 21, 2005 6:43:38 GMT -5
Yes I would say it' s a nice place , Platypus , but I' m not so sure Ponto would agree , so I will say it is a beautiful place , perhaps . Even though I have not clear where it is . I suspect in Congo , but not the eastern one , the central one .
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Post by Platypus on Jun 21, 2005 7:50:36 GMT -5
Hang on Bert....
The surname of the Lombard guy I've posted above is Bertolino (BERTolino) The Milanese girl's surname is Gusberti (gusBERTi) Funny ha?
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Post by hs on Jun 21, 2005 9:09:28 GMT -5
Hang on Bert.... The surname of the Lombard guy I've posted above is Bertolino (BERTolino) The Milanese girl's surname is Gusberti (gusBERTi) Funny ha? Platypus, Gusberti is not less germanic than Jagger. A great deal of Italian names are of Germanic origins. If you stumble upon Garibaldi, Autari, Alboino, Grimaldi, ..., remember the Lombards.
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Post by Ponto Hardbottle on Jun 21, 2005 9:17:04 GMT -5
bert, get someone to proofread your English. What you have written makes little sense. Congo! I can tell Australians from different States, and I am a foreigner in Australia. It isn't hard to distinguish people from different towns, cities, States when you are from that country. It does not surprise me that you can tell Southerners from Northerners. But if you are saying it is because of their height or skin tone or hair color, I don't believe you. As for the English, I wouldn't judge a crowd around Lago di Garda as being typical of the English. Most English wouldn't know Lago di Garda from Barnstaple. Have you been to England? There are lots of immigrants there, Indians, Chinese, Greeks, Italians, Albanians, you name it they are there. Maybe your English are actually second generation English of Italian descent. Who knows with your anecdotes what you are talking about? I lived in England for 10 years. I have lived around Anglos most of my life, they are similar to Germans with a touch more Atlantids. You don't get it. Being 2.0 m tall, having blond hair and blue eyes does not make you Nordid or Germanic. Having dark hair or brown eyes and being 1.6 m in height does not make you Mediterranid. Blond blue eyed tall Italians don't look like blond blue eyed tall Swedes. A dark haired dark eyed Swede does not look Italian. Having Germanic names does not make people Germanic. Speaking German does not make you German. Platypus What is so special about East Anglia? Good farming land. Rather flat and boggy. And somewhat boring.
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