Manji
New Member
Posts: 21
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Post by Manji on May 4, 2004 10:33:35 GMT -5
 Would you call her "celtic" looking? What got me asking this was after reading Dienekes post about the celtic origins of Catherine Zeta Jones and the comments of one Professor Paul Brain, evolutionary zoologist , that, I quote: "Catherine is a case of a natural Celtic beauty... she stands out in Hollywood as the one with the curves and the jet black hair - that comes from her Welsh blood - when a lot of women can look a bit bland." Also: "In Welsh women, I suspect that it is something to do with their overall shape - the symmetry of their facial features is very regular...They tend to have long lustrous dark hair and are pretty fine boned." Also: "Welsh women tend to be shorter...With Welsh women, the contrast in their looks - between the Celtic dark hair and the white of their skins - is an attractive combination...pictures of historical Welsh beauties, such as Nell Gwyn, the mistress of Charles II, showed they had full lips... and to end: "Zeta Jones is typically Welsh looking and has dark skin which is not unusual in the south west region of Wales" So, according to this source, dark hair (black in some cases), full lips, short stature a tanned looking skin, and light boned, are all Celtic features. Is this right? I was under the (perhaps wrong) impression that "celtic" looking people were supposed to have pinkish-white skin, strong bones (specially facial) and blonde to red hair. Or am I confusing celtic with irish? People comment  |
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Post by executiona9 on May 4, 2004 13:42:06 GMT -5
Here is my opinion :
Zeta Jones does not look Celtic. She looks Iberian. The iberians were mediterranean looking people (brown hair, brown eyes). They were the first inhabitants of Britain and Ireland. They are pre-celtic.
The Celts were some sort of intermediate between the Germanics and Romans, the Celts were not as dark as the Romans and not as blond as the Germanics.
Most Celts had blue or green eyes. The most common haircolour among Celtic children was blond, the most common haircolour among Celtic adults was brown (haircolour darkens with age).
Red hair is not a celtic trait like many people wish to believe.
Slavs, Germanics, Celts and even Romans can all have red hair, but its usually rare among these groups (2 or 3 %).
Red hair is typical for the Picts. The reason why red hair is more common in Britain/Ireland than in the rest of Europe is because Britain/Ireland has partly Pict ancestry and the rest of Europe doesnt.
Welsh people are mostly Celtic, the average Welshman has an average look : not dark, not light. Welsh people look the same as the Irish and Scottish.
A minority of Welsh have a dark mediterranean look, this is because of the Iberian blood (example : Zeta Jones). Another minority of the Welsh is very pale and has red hair, this is because of the Pict blood.
The same accounts for Ireland and Scotland : some irish and scottish look mediterranean (iberian blood), some irish and scottish are very pale with red hair (pict blood), and most irish and scottish look average, not dark not light (Celtic blood)
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Post by AWAR on May 4, 2004 14:39:49 GMT -5
The Celts were originally an IE speaking central European people who made a significant impact on western, northwestern and southwestern Europe in terms of culture and language, but they left little racial influence.
Catherine Zeta Jones is just one example of many indigenous western European types which originated in the Iberian peninsula. These peoples adopted the IE languages, but remained genetically mostly pre-Celtic.
Todays Celts are not genetically very related to the original Celts of central Europe.
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Post by executiona9 on May 4, 2004 15:30:43 GMT -5
I know about this theory that Western-Europeans have little aryan (germanic, roman, celtic etc) ancestry, and that Ukranians, Poles and Hungarians are the most aryan people in the world because they possess the greatest amounts of HG3 on their y chromosome.
It was introduced by Cavalli Sforza who proposed the hypothesis that only Y-chromsome EU19 (HG3) is aryan.
However you should keep in mind that its only a hypothesis. It doesnt have to be true. Nothing has been proven yet.
Therefore personally I stick to the old fashion of classifying most West-Europeans as aryan (celtic, germanic, roman).
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Post by Aria88 on May 4, 2004 19:54:21 GMT -5
Most of what has been said vis-a-vis the Celts/Welsh I am in full agreement with. Yes, there is a swarthy Mediterranean element from the autochthonous Iberian-related folk.
Meanwhile it would be helpful to point that Catherine Zeta Jones is of Welsh and also Greek ancestry.
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Post by Artemidoros on May 5, 2004 4:18:33 GMT -5
Most of what has been said vis-a-vis the Celts/Welsh I am in full agreement with. Yes, there is a swarthy Mediterranean element from the autochthonous Iberian-related folk. Meanwhile it would be helpful to point that Catherine Zeta Jones is of Welsh and also Greek ancestry. She has no Greek ancestry. It's a misunderstanding. Zeta doesn't sound like a Welsh name?
It's Greek. I have no Greek blood in me. It's just my great-grandfather was on a ship called the Zeta and he called my grandmother that and then my father took it on as name.
www.well-rounded.com/movies/reviews/zeta-jones_intv.html |
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Post by kynikos on May 5, 2004 5:22:18 GMT -5
Well I don't know if you call it Celtic or whatever, but, Catherine Zeta Jones is a VERY typical Welsh-looking lass, as I am sure that all of us who spend a lot of time in Wales can attest. In the summer, if you visit popular Welsh resorts, half the time you feel that the girls working there are her cousins. Charlotte Church, the young opera singer is another representative example... www.charlottechurchfans.com/features/cc_roy.html |
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Post by executiona9 on May 5, 2004 7:31:07 GMT -5
Catherina Zeta Jones does not look typical Welsh. She looks darker than the average Welsh person. Just like Collin Farrel looks darker than the average Irish person. Welsh, Scottish and Irish people all look the same. They are indistinguishable from eachother. Here are some pictures of Welsh people :    |
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Post by Graeme on May 5, 2004 8:29:33 GMT -5
If Jones got $1 everytime someone referred to her looks on an anthrology forum she would never have to do movies again to earn money, same with Sean Connery and Farrell. Is it so bad to be a darker Kelt? Real live Kelts are not a race or sub race only the definition of Keltic Nordic is a sub racial type which can have nothing at all to do with living Irish, Scots or Cymrics. Welsh = foreigner, so I prefer not to use it. The facts are that Cymrics like other Keltic or formerly Keltic speaking people in Britain come in many sizes, shapes and shades of skin tones. It is also a fact that most the people in Britain have pre Keltic ancestry originating in Iberia thousands of years ago. Cymrics are also known to have a darker element among them. The Scots and Irish have darker elements in their population also. It does not mean they are any less Keltic than anyone else of Scottish, Irish or Cymric pedigree. And I would not describe them as swarthy just dark in the European range not in some non European range. Zeta is a name and does not imply ethnic origin. Maybe having lived in Britain for many years means that I am more accepting of the racial sub types found there including dark Kelts or even brunet English types. They are a very mixed bunch of people. Was Dante Gabriel Rossetti dark?
No one knows where red hair comes from. The Picts are a mysterious people not known for red hair, but for their dark looks. I do not accept that red hair is derived from our UP ancestors with the implication that those nationalities with greater percentages of red hair are more UP. Red hair is found in Europeans and its higher prevalence in Keltic areas has more to do with genetic drift and founder effect than anything racial.
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Post by executiona9 on May 5, 2004 8:58:12 GMT -5
Some information sources claim the Picts had red hair. Other information sources indeed claim the Picts had dark looks.
The Picts are indeed a mysterious people.
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Post by SwordandCompass on May 5, 2004 11:32:35 GMT -5
executiona9
kill the large photos just a link.
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Post by kynikos on May 5, 2004 16:12:20 GMT -5
You don't visit Wales a lot, do you executiona9?
Wonder what comment the "average" Taff would make about looking the "same" as the Scots? ;D ;D ;D
Nice one! I wonder why they pick...her? ;D
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Post by Artemidoros on May 5, 2004 19:45:34 GMT -5
In the summer, if you visit popular Welsh resorts, half the time you feel that the girls working there are her cousins. I will be in Wales the first week of June. I will be very disappointed if I find this to be an exaggeration. |
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Ioulianos
Full Member
Anegnon,Egnon,Kategnon
Posts: 199
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Post by Ioulianos on May 5, 2004 21:28:14 GMT -5
Other famous Welsh that i know exept Catherine-Zeta Jones are Tom Jones and Ryan Giggs.They both are darker than average British people.
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Post by executiona9 on May 6, 2004 4:48:23 GMT -5
Ryan Giggs has a black or half black father, I forgot. Ryan Giggs is at least 25 % negroid.
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