Madison Grant

[brazen]

Any of you familiar with Madison Grant? Any of you ever read his book called "The passing of the great race" ?Even though it's largely unknown now to most people it was a quite popular back in 1916 when it was written. Heres an article from Wikipedia about Madison Grant and his book.


en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madison_Grant



I recently read his book The passing of the great race. I don't agree with any of it, the man was a hardcore Nordicist who believed that the One -drop- rule should be applied to all non-white races including southern and eastern Europeans because he didn't consider them white. His book was like a bible to the Nazis and as a matter of fact Adolf Hitler even wrote a letter to Grant saying "This book is my bible" The book was also responsible for encouraging many states to adopt anti-miscegenation laws and for the national anti-immigrant laws of the 1920's

[wendland]

It's another racist, or better racialist product of the early 20th Century, full of ideas influenced by 19th Century Romanticism, and intrinsically opposed to empirical science. So, very inspirational for Nazis, but otherwise crap. Incidentally, a lot of those types, there was a guy Chamberlain (I think that's his name), and a French guy (forget the name) who espoused the same types of theories generally considered Germany to be too little nordic-- how ironic for Hitler (but I guess he ignored that part).

[murphee]

The Frenchman was Gobineau.

[wendland]

Thanks, Murphee. By the way, what do all these guys always seem to have against the poor maligned Alpines? They reserve such contempt for them. My grandmother is one down to a tee, so her legs are a bit short, and she tans well... But, does that make her so "unnoble"? LOL

[murphee]

I'm guessing that it's because they were Nordicists to the core.

[wendland]

Yeah, but the whole thing is a bit funny because you often find different "types" in the same families.

[dukeofpain]

wendland said:

It's another racist, or better racialist product of the early 20th Century, full of ideas influenced by 19th Century Romanticism, and intrinsically opposed to empirical science. So, very inspirational for Nazis, but otherwise crap. Incidentally, a lot of those types, there was a guy Chamberlain (I think that's his name), and a French guy (forget the name) who espoused the same types of theories generally considered Germany to be too little nordic-- how ironic for Hitler (but I guess he ignored that part).

The nazis were never under a pretense of being a nordic nation. Most of the race stuff came to be only after the war began, whether it be for German propaganda use, or likewise soviet propaganda use. What was taught in school infact was that germany was made up of several races including: Nordic (nordische) , the Pfalzish (fälische), the Western (westliche) the East Baltic (ostbaltische) The Ostic (ostische) and the Dinarish (dinarische) races.

The only hardcore "nordicist" was himmler, whom was coinsidinly very influential. Though even his fanaticism started to die down, especially after the russian advance.

[aroundtheworld]

It sucks that people like this Grant guy get to establish the basis or race for ALL people.

[Crimson Guard]

The Germans at the time period were on and off the "White " list,which angered many germans,and probably made them hardcore Nordicists over the years,just to prove their whiteness before the whole world.

Hans Guenther never claimed the Germans where Nordic's either,nor was he very pan-German,he just had a hard on for Blond males and females types that tickled his fancy..just after the start of WW2 Grant changed his view on the Germans and called them mongrel's and inferior in his updated and revised book/work...which goes back even to Benjamin Franklin days when Germans where not considered white like the English who where.

In fact both Drooperdoo and I where discussing similar things recently.

[wendland]

The conundrum of "being white enough" seems to affect basically everyone, like the Germans (not considered "white" enough, though probably they would have expressed it as Arisch or Nordisch, not really as "weiss"-- that's a more American thing.) Now the deconstruction of the English-AngloSaxon connection may also strike some as a "de-whitening" (obviously whatever other people they are besides AngloSaxons, they are just as white). But that does seem to have struck a nerve in some people.
An anecdote: In my experience, Germans (probably older people now) tend to think of the English (British) as somehow a bit lighter, more nordic, more svelt, etc... "Whiter" so to speak. Once an Irish folk dancing troup was performing on TV, and all the dancers had dark hair. I have to note that a lot of Germans less educated in such matters DO NOT distinguish between Irish, English, Welsh, Scottish, they're all "English". People were really surprised that they weren't all blond, or at least red haired.