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Post by Crimson Guard on May 28, 2005 14:43:34 GMT -5
I even just read this complete book of fantasy called "Early Civilizations of the Nordic Peoples" by Roger Pearson M.S,it has a expostition by Professor Hans Guenther.Here all great civilizations where Nordic until they where corrupted by lesser races.
Interesting read into what they actually thought as true and some morons still do.
But when comparing Coon to these other Professors during that time frame,he was in no way as racialist let alone eccentric . So to dismiss on those grounds alone is a very big mistake..He's was fairly(though not completly) neutral,his work was mostly often neutral and insightful.
Bass should blast a guy like Eugentist writer,lawyer Madison Grant who was a true loonytoon and really harmful.
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Post by Platypus on May 28, 2005 14:44:07 GMT -5
Woa good Thread!
to Charlie Bass.
Remember that Coon Lived and wrote in the mid 1900's. Fortunately we' ve made huge steps towards racial integration since, Therefore we should not take what Anthropologists wrote then and compare it to the situation nowadays. It would be a bit like criticizing Alexander the Great for not using guns in his battles:)
Coon was mainly interested in the UP/'Nordic' issue (and as such he classyfied himself), Which from a WASP north American is understandable. In later works he scaled down the existence today of pure 'neolithic Nordics'
His writings on eastern Europe are more superficial showing less interest or lack of info, while instead Albania and north Africa were studied with more care, maybe because he seemed to have visited those areas.
To all: Is Coon's Races of Europe and other works ,still published and available to buy? (or download)
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Post by Crimson Guard on May 28, 2005 14:45:58 GMT -5
<<To all: Is Coon's Races of Europe, still published and available to buy? >>
go to amazon.com!
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Post by Platypus on May 28, 2005 14:53:43 GMT -5
Thanks
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Post by Platypus on May 28, 2005 14:58:48 GMT -5
woah!! they're asking around 450$ for it !!
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Post by Crimson Guard on May 28, 2005 15:40:41 GMT -5
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Post by eufrenio on May 29, 2005 9:45:12 GMT -5
To all: Is Coon's Races of Europe and other works ,still published and available to buy? (or download) Races of Europe use to be available online here: www.fikas.no/~sprocket/snpa/racesofeurope.htmIt seems to be down now, but I´m sure the SNPA has a new url somewhere.
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Post by Platypus on May 29, 2005 10:23:22 GMT -5
The new link www.nordish.com/most of it is there, unfortunately leaves out N.Africa
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Post by topdog on May 29, 2005 13:07:31 GMT -5
I even just read this complete book of fantasy called "Early Civilizations of the Nordic Peoples" by Roger Pearson M.S,it has a expostition by Professor Hans Guenther.Here all great civilizations where Nordic until they where corrupted by lesser races. Interesting read into what they actually thought as true and some morons still do. But when comparing Coon to these other Professors during that time frame,he was in no way as racialist let alone eccentric . So to dismiss on those grounds alone is a very big mistake..He's was fairly(though not completly) neutral,his work was mostly often neutral and insightful. Bass should blast a guy like Eugentist writer,lawyer Madison Grant who was a true loonytoon and really harmful. Because Coon wasn't exactly like those racialists you mentioned doesn't make his work more valid and it doesn't change the fact that he should have spoken out against those who misused his work. failing to denounce such racialists can compromise the integrity of his work and science.
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Post by topdog on Jun 3, 2005 4:35:30 GMT -5
Taken from his book 'The Origin of Races'
"If Africa was the cradle of mankind it was only an indifferent kindergarten. European and asia were our principal schools." [p. 656]
"As far as we know, the Congoid line started on the same evolutionary level as the Eurasiatic ones in the Early Middle Pleistocene and then stood still for half a million years, after which Negroes and Pygmies appeared as if out of nowhere" [p. 658]
Mike the Briton, Vela, and Crimson Guard, where are you all?
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Post by mike2 on Jun 3, 2005 5:09:00 GMT -5
I'm here and I've said all that's needed to be a said about Coon. He was a man of his time and no excuses need to be made for him. It is best if you completely ignore his observations of black Africa and just read what he wrote about European racial types. That's the only reason I read him anyway.
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Post by topdog on Jun 3, 2005 5:34:06 GMT -5
I'm here and I've said all that's needed to be a said about Coon. He was a man of his time and no excuses need to be made for him. It is best if you completely ignore his observations of black Africa and just read what he wrote about European racial types. That's the only reason I read him anyway. He was just as wrong about Europe in some cases as he was wrong about Africa.
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Post by Wadaad on Jun 3, 2005 5:42:23 GMT -5
Anthropology is one of those social sciences where bias, politics and personal opinions play a big hand in alot of theses. Coon was definitely a man of his time, and a forward thinking one at that...but still his theories are outdated and sometimes, plain racist. His observations on the European racial types, however, just proves that everyone should concentrate on his/her own race and subdivide it however he may deem fit. I actually envy his work on Europeans, the detail he goes into and the tons of sub-subdivisions he creates just shows how much he valued that bit of research.
Similarly, to avoid bias and guarantee a level of scientific interest and "whats at stake here" African populations need an African anthropologist to observe the difference between different groups. I cannot see a European or in Coon's case a 20th century American anthropologist thinking its worth his time to go into concentrating on African racial sub-divisions.
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Post by Ponto Hardbottle on Jun 3, 2005 8:28:40 GMT -5
Social sciences are a crock and not sciences. Anthropology is not a science and neither is race classification. Coon's ideas are no better or worse than the guff that is coming from those geneticists analysing Y chromosome or mtDNA haplogroups. You mark my words, the interpretations of those haplogroup results will be considered ridiculous and pseudoscientific just as Coon's ideas about Neanderthal admixture. The observed results of racial variation and the genetic results are valid, the interpretations of those same are ludicrous. There is no way that some of those things can be proven. The origin of the Dinarid type cannot be proven to be a mix of other caucasoid types. And where is the proof that the Corded ware people or the Danubian people were the precursors of the Nordid type? What is true is that there are Nordids, Mediterranids, Alpinids, Dinarids, UP types and mixed types but their origins are not simply due to Neolithics or Palaeolithics or recent blowins from West Asia or old bones of defunct people. No-one can prove the origins of those people. I know mtDNA and Y chromosome haplogroups have been used to try to do that, but frankly those that indicate that their results are proof of their hypotheses are skating on very thin ice.
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Post by Wadaad on Jun 3, 2005 12:44:36 GMT -5
Social sciences are a crock and not sciences. Anthropology is not a science and neither is race classification. Coon's ideas are no better or worse than the guff that is coming from those geneticists analysing Y chromosome or mtDNA haplogroups. You mark my words, the interpretations of those haplogroup results will be considered ridiculous and pseudoscientific just as Coon's ideas about Neanderthal admixture. The observed results of racial variation and the genetic results are valid, the interpretations of those same are ludicrous. There is no way that some of those things can be proven. The origin of the Dinarid type cannot be proven to be a mix of other caucasoid types. And where is the proof that the Corded ware people or the Danubian people were the precursors of the Nordid type? What is true is that there are Nordids, Mediterranids, Alpinids, Dinarids, UP types and mixed types but their origins are not simply due to Neolithics or Palaeolithics or recent blowins from West Asia or old bones of defunct people. No-one can prove the origins of those people. I know mtDNA and Y chromosome haplogroups have been used to try to do that, but frankly those that indicate that their results are proof of their hypotheses are skating on very thin ice. Holy shit Ponto, you took the words right out of my mouth...couldnt have said it better if I tried. I agree completely
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