Northern Europeans have weak genes?

[NuSapiens]

quartermetis said:

The South African woman's name is Sandra Laing, fascinating story.

news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/2944922.stm

Did anyone conduct a genetic test to ensure that Sandra was indeed her father's daughter? Nonpaternity would be the simplest explanation.

If she was indeed her father's daughter, then this is an interesting illustration of recessive genes appearing in a pedigree generations after admixture.

[eufrenio]

NuSapiens said:

Did anyone conduct a genetic test to ensure that Sandra was indeed her father's daughter? Nonpaternity would be the simplest explanation.

If she was indeed her father's daughter, then this is an interesting illustration of recessive genes appearing in a pedigree generations after admixture.

Yes, they did perform a paternity test, and she was indeed her daddy´s daughter. She was a "throwback".

In 1967, the race classification law was changed to say that the children of two white parents cannot be reclassified into another group, but before I could be reclassified white there had to be proof I was the biological child of my two white parents. They took blood from my right arm and my parents had to be tested too. The tests confirmed that I was indeed the child of both my white parents, so I was reclassified white.

www.suntimes.co.za/2000/01/02/millennium/mil03.htm

[CCC]

Which is ironic because her family (brothers) are still considered "white" in South Africa. In fact they are very traditionally conservative Afrikaners. There's a lot of hidden secrets in the Afrikaner gene pool.

[buddyrydell]

CCC said:

Which is ironic because her family (brothers) are still considered "white" in South Africa. In fact they are very traditionally conservative Afrikaners. There's a lot of hidden secrets in the Afrikaner gene pool.

That's true. I once read an analysis on the Afrikaners that showed that they actually have fairly considerable African admixture.

[CCC]

buddyrydell said:

That's true. I once read an analysis on the Afrikaners that showed that they actually have fairly considerable African admixture.

African and Asiatic, the dutch imported a lot of Malaysian and Indonesian slaves to the Cape Colony, in fact the 3rd largest "ethnic group" in South Africa today are the Coloureds who are a tri-racial (Black African, Asian, and European [mainly Dutch, German, Belgian, and French]) mixed Afrikaner speaking community.

[Human]

CCC said:

African and Asiatic, the dutch imported a lot of Malaysian and Indonesian slaves to the Cape Colony, in fact the 3rd largest "ethnic group" in South Africa today are the Coloureds who are a tri-racial (Black African, Asian, and European [mainly Dutch, German, Belgian, and French]) mixed Afrikaner speaking community.

they do have. even the krugers. they had an early hottentot/bantu infusion, which later was absorbed by more european blood, during gold rush...

[Human]

here is Sandra Laing

img177.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img177&image=sandralaing1yt.png

Thanks to ImageShack for Free Image Hosting

[Human]

crazy story, worth a film indeed.


I AM Sandra Laing. I was born in November 1955 in Piet Retief. My parents are white. I have two brothers. They are also white. I attended the Deborah Retief boarding school from the age of five. In 1966, when I was 10, the police came to take me away from the school.


Mr Van Tonder, the principal, said I was not white and could not stay. I was taken to the hostel and told to pack my things. Two policemen drove me to my father's shop in Panbult. They said I was being expelled because I looked different. I had darker skin and curly hair. My father cried. I stayed at home for two years.

'Apartheid has ended, and I'd like to shake Mr Mandela's hand for that, but it is too late for me'

My family spoke Afrikaans and we attended the Dutch Reformed Church. My mother, Sannie, is one of three daughters from the Roux family. My father was Abraham Laing, a very strict man who always led the prayers at family meal times. My father and mother ran the family businesses in Panbult and Brereton Park respectively; they were busy and I was taken care of by a nanny. I think her name was Rosie. All my friends were black and they were mainly the children of the people who worked for us.


I was not happy at school - the other children said I was not white and why was I attending their school? This happened all the time, inside and outside the classroom and in the hostel. I had no friends. The teachers knew about the teasing and taunting but did nothing to stop it. I went to complain to Mr Van Tonder, but he just laughed and told me to stay out of their way. I had no choice but to fight back. I sometimes hit some of them.


It took the parents and the school body three years to have me expelled, because first I had to be reclassified coloured. I was confused and asked many questions. My mother said "things will come right", and my father appealed against my reclassification as a coloured, but he was unsuccessful. I understand that nine schools rejected my application to enrol, so I continued my schooling by correspondence for the next two years.


In 1967, the race classification law was changed to say that the children of two white parents cannot be reclassified into another group, but before I could be reclassified white there had to be proof I was the biological child of my two white parents. They took blood from my right arm and my parents had to be tested too. The tests confirmed that I was indeed the child of both my white parents, so I was reclassified white. The Education Department then ruled that I could return to the Deborah Retief primary school but recommended that in my own interests I should not be re-admitted to the hostel.


Being reclassified white did not stop the manager of the Ermelo café from refusing to serve me the food my father and I had ordered. No blacks ate at his restaurant, he said. My father said I was his daughter before he got up and left, feeling very angry.


After two years of correspondence school I enrolled at a convent in Newcastle. The nuns were good to me and I made two friends - one from Standerton and another from Zambia. During the school holidays I helped my mother and father in their shops. I sometimes went to church but I was not comfortable. It seemed like the other churchgoers did not want me among them. I heard and felt some remarks that were aimed at me. I went to church less frequently but continued to read the Bible in search of the answers I did not find. I thought there was some fault that I looked different, but couldn't find an explanation. I had darker skin and curlier hair than I was supposed to have. My mother always asked me to stay out of the sun as it made me even darker. I felt a lot of pain and thought it would be best if I left and stayed with people I felt happier with. After my Standard 7 vacation I did not return to school and left home with Petrus Zwane. I met him when he started selling vegetables at our shop, and became friendly with him. He was Zulu-speaking. I was 16.


I was welcomed into the Zwane family. They live near Carolina and we stayed with them while Petrus built us a home in Kromkrans, near Hendrina. Our first child, Henry, was born there. We had a small shop and owned a Volkswagen. I went to show my son to my mother. Henry is my parents' first grandchild. After my second child was born, my mother gave me a box of baby clothes and asked me not to return. She was happy to see me, but my father did not want to know anything about me. She asked me to write or telephone but not to visit. That was in 1973.


That same year I turned 18 and applied for an identity document. The officials said I was white, but if they were to give me the white identity document they would have to take my two children away from me because they were not white. I could apply for a coloured ID, but that required the consent of my father, and he refused. I had to wait until I was 21, they said, and then I did not need anyone's consent.


In 1976, when there were uprisings against apartheid and the education system, I turned 21 and I thought things would change. I applied for an identity document then, but it took six years before I finally got my first ID as a coloured. Until then I could not prove who I was or find work or open an account or do whatever a person has to do. Through those years I longed for my family, just to hear from them. I wrote several letters but they remained unanswered.


In 1989 I went to visit my cousin in Amsterdam. She told me my father had passed away the previous year and she gave me my mother's contact details. After that my mother wrote to me and sent me some money which she said I had inherited from my father. I have read the letter many times, as she wrote, "Ek skryf sonder adres " (I write without an address). The next year Nelson Mandela was released. But since then no one in my family has attempted to contact me. I don't know where they are. Apartheid has ended, and I would like to shake Mr Mandela's hand for that, but it is too late for me.

www.suntimes.co.za/2000/01/02/millennium/mil03.htm

[Shenuda]

Kame said:

Why is that half northern european mullato's look mostly african in appearance( like 60-75% black)? The SSA phenotype dominates them almost completely. Also blond hair is a known recessive trait as well as blue eyes.

I have seen quite a bit of north euro type mullato's, because most mullato's in the US are the result of unions between generic nordic american whites (women) and af-ams. They almost always look more black than white.( even though af-ams are about 20% white). Why is this?

Has anyone ever heard about that black girl in south africa born to white parents by the way? I think her name was sannie laing or something like that.

What will the children of seal (nigerian) and heidi klum(german) look like? Probably more black-looking, I would put money on that.

This is not so much the case with south euro's mulatto's however, their features are more rounded out it seems. Especially with Italians.

I don´t agree. Southern Europeans have maybe a little sharper features than Northern Europeans, so "mediterrean" mulattos have on average a little bit more caucasoid look, but as far as I know most of North European mulattos don´t look 60-75% negroid. The difference is only slight.

[gambler32]

www.geocities.com/cafeaulait2005/

Other Nordic/African celebrities include Swedish/Ethiopian singer Emilia Rydberg and German/Ghanian actor Boris Kodjoe. Nordic/African mixtures, especially Northern European and Southern African (Bantu), are usually considered 'more mulatto' than American mixtures, due to the often less extreme variations in complexions and physical traits.

The Nordic/African type is not confined to Northern Europe and Africa only. It exists in significant numbers in the United States and Canada where it has more or less blended with the other mixed types of the Americas. Nevertheless, Northern Europe and Africa can be regarded as "refuge areas" for this type.

Throughout the history of the intermingling of their two ancestral populations, the features of the Nordic/African female have been considered the ultimate ideal of beauty.

Nevertheless, the Med/African is the mixed type most common in North Africa and Southern Europe. Mediterranean/African types tend to be less robust than the Nordic/Bantu, with more harmonious features, narrower noses, and leaner builds.

The Mediterranean/African type came to be in Southern Europe as a result of multiple wars and slave trades. However, this type came to be in North Africa largely as a result of continuous and casual interactions between the native black population of North Africa and the Middle Easterners who began migrating into the region thousands of years ago. The mixing continued even after the desiccation and expansion of the Sahara and the migration of its black inhabitants into surrounding regions. The Touareg of West Africa, though a predominantly African Southern Berber tribe, are a unique example of the Middle Eastern/West African sub-type. The tribes in North Africa (Northern Berbers), though predominantly Middle Eastern, are also recognized for having many members of this type.

[gambler32]

CCC said:

Which is ironic because her family (brothers) are still considered "white" in South Africa. In fact they are very traditionally conservative Afrikaners. There's a lot of hidden secrets in the Afrikaner gene pool.

www.geocities.com/kempcountrymen/

[gambler32]

www.geocities.com/kempcountrymen/

"It is little known that an Indian woman from Bengal - given a Christian name "Mary" - was taken as a slave to the Cape in 1653, a year after Jan van Riebeeck settled there. For the next century or more, thousands of Indians from Bengal, Coromandel Coast and Kerala were taken to South Africa and sold into slavery - mostly in Dutch ships, but some in Danish and British ships.

Some were bought in India from slave traders, especially the Portuguese; some were children bought from their helpless parents during famines in Tamil Nadu; some were servants who were cheated and sold as slaves; and some were kidnapped. Many of these were perhaps more literate and more skilled than their Dutch masters.

According to some scholars on slavery in South Africa, the number of slaves from India exceeded those from Indonesia or Africa.



The Dutch settlers married some Indian women. There was extensive miscegenation and many settlers, in their old age, formally married their mistresses and baptised their children. As a result, numerous Afrikaner families can trace their ancestry to Indians and perhaps half the Coloured people have Indian ancestry."

"I said in Cape Town that the Afrikaners had been cursed for rejecting their ancestors and inventing the false mythology of apartheid in the 19th and 20th centuries. That is sad because researchers have now proved that Afrikaners with black ancestry include even Paul Kruger and General Louis Botha, not to mention some curremt right-wing politicians. I hope that the Afrikaners will rediscover their history."

[Human]

A.U.C.T.O.R.I.T.A.S. said:

Actually, I've found that while Sub-Saharan African genes dominate in S.S.A./White biracial offspring, the German phenotype seems particularly strong in subracial miscegenation. Not Nordic, but specifically German i.e. a White person with 1/4 German will usually tend towards a Germanic phenotype. Certainly, children of Northern Europeans and Southern Europeans tend towards a central European phenotype, which of course, leans heavily northward, and in some cases is identical except for reduced blondism. I've seen Central Europeans and Northern Europeans with the same phentope, but the former was brunette and the latter was blonde - no difference in skin pigmentation at all.

i agree that German phenotype tends to predominate over other European ethnicities.

[gambler32]

CCC said:

Which is ironic because her family (brothers) are still considered "white" in South Africa. In fact they are very traditionally conservative Afrikaners. There's a lot of hidden secrets in the Afrikaner gene pool.

With the small number of European females in the Cape many of the slave women or their daughters became the lovers and wives of the burghers. The soldiers and sailors were uprooted from Europe, they were bereft of female company. A change in social dynamics took place, progression from slavery to mistress of a household, sex gave many a slave women her freedom but not for the males. Later burghers, preferred marriages to women from these mixed unions, in other words these women were then classified as 'van de Kaap' (note this term did not only refer to people of black or mix ancestry). In Valkhoff's book J. Hoge quotes on p 99 that in 1667 of the list of free burghers there were only 19 women compared to 100 male free burghers. Valkhoff continues that thirty years after the foundation of the Colony there were not more than 25 white women. In 1707 when Governor W.A van der Stel left the demographics at the Cape were: 513 freemen, 290 freewomen, 848 children, 128 knechts (mainly bachelors), 841 male slaves, 149 female slaves, and 117 slave children.

The South African Library in 1981 published in two volumes the Het Nederduitsch Zuid-Afrikaansch Tydschrift 1824-1843. In it is given the following statistics:
In 1688 there were 254 Christian men, 88 Christian women, 231 Christian children, 230 slavemen, 44 slave women, 36 slave children
In 1694 there were 446 Christian men, 295 Christian women, 431 Christian children, 325 slavemen, 64 slave women, 58 slave children
Thus in 1688 there were 484 men to 132 women
In 1694 there were 771 men to 359 women


The male/female ratio needs to also take into account all the company servants who were predominately males. In the book edited by Elphick and Gilliomee The Shaping of South African Society it is mentioned on p 196 that in 1664 out of 178 company employees only 6 had their wives with them.


The visiting male sailors who stopped at the Cape also participated in the entertainment and the love scene (quoted in M.W. Spilhaus, The First South Africans p 33). To get an idea of the shipping traffic at the Cape, Elphick and Gilliomee states on p 196, that between 1701 and 1710 there were an average of 68 ship per year visiting the Cape. On each ship there were 70 to 300 men. The ratio between men and women was way out of proportion. The choice of burghers marrying slaves are rather interesting. Robert Shell p 322 "Of the 191 slave women who married or lived with men of German descent in the seventeenth and early eighteenth century, the majority (59.7 percent) were Creole (Cape-born), many possibly mulatto. The next largest group of slave spouses were from the Indonesian Archipelago (22.5 percent) and 15.2 percent of the slave wives were from India, all from Bengal." Whereas very few marriages, 3 percent slave wives were from Malagasy and Africa. The Malay word "nyai" was the term used by the Dutch to denote a concubine to a European, or a housekeeper refer to J.G. Taylor The Social world of Batavia p 228. One wonders whether the Afrikaans word 'naai' - sex, which etymologist usually only attribute its origins from meaning "sew" does not also have a secondary connections back to this usage. It should also be remembered that the best chance of a female slave obtaining her freedom was to become sexually involved with her owner. Many a slave owner freed either his slave women and her children which in many cases the slave owner fathered. Many female slaves thus became the mothers of the settlers and slave owners in turn.

rest of the story click here> www.geocities.com/Athens/Rhodes/1266/genetic.htm

[Samhain]

British mulattos...(all fathers are absent and black)