Post by Sandwich on Jul 1, 2004 0:16:23 GMT -5
Is Austria part of NW Europe?
There really is no reason to call France NW Europe. That is something that Americans do - from their purely geographic perspective, far across the Atlantic, I suppose it is. But from a European perspective - historical, cultural, and geographical, France is the bridge between North and South, and if you don't mind a moving bridge, the axis, of Europe.
This is getting silly, but let's just look at mathematicians - I think we're agreed that mathematics is the queen of the sciences?
This is a really fun site www-gap.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/~history/BirthplaceMaps/Places/Europe.html where you can investigate important mathematicians, their contributions and inter-actions.
You'll see that France and England dominate, with Germany third, and that if one were to confine oneself to the truly major innovators, the French and English contribution would be even more important. You can also investigate the very significant Italian contribution: consider the importance of Lagrange and Peano alone.
The only thing that prevents this whole discussion being an absurd pissing contest is the inclusion of France in NW Europe. Recognize it for what it is, a non-Nordic country with a romance language culture, Catholic to boot, inextricably linked to Italy and Spain, and the differences do not boil down to anything worth debating.
See here for the country tabulation.
www-gap.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/~history/BirthplaceMaps/Countries/index.html
Compare Italy - 101 and the USA - 108. You can make this a semantic issue about selectivity if you want, but there's some underlying reality there, for sure.
Go on to claim that America by itself has by now made a contribution to mathematics remotely comparable to Europe's - (now including Britain and Germany) - and you're on what we Brits call a very sticky wicket. But then no one in Europe or America knows what that is, do they?
There really is no reason to call France NW Europe. That is something that Americans do - from their purely geographic perspective, far across the Atlantic, I suppose it is. But from a European perspective - historical, cultural, and geographical, France is the bridge between North and South, and if you don't mind a moving bridge, the axis, of Europe.
This is getting silly, but let's just look at mathematicians - I think we're agreed that mathematics is the queen of the sciences?
This is a really fun site www-gap.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/~history/BirthplaceMaps/Places/Europe.html where you can investigate important mathematicians, their contributions and inter-actions.
You'll see that France and England dominate, with Germany third, and that if one were to confine oneself to the truly major innovators, the French and English contribution would be even more important. You can also investigate the very significant Italian contribution: consider the importance of Lagrange and Peano alone.
The only thing that prevents this whole discussion being an absurd pissing contest is the inclusion of France in NW Europe. Recognize it for what it is, a non-Nordic country with a romance language culture, Catholic to boot, inextricably linked to Italy and Spain, and the differences do not boil down to anything worth debating.
See here for the country tabulation.
www-gap.dcs.st-and.ac.uk/~history/BirthplaceMaps/Countries/index.html
Compare Italy - 101 and the USA - 108. You can make this a semantic issue about selectivity if you want, but there's some underlying reality there, for sure.
Go on to claim that America by itself has by now made a contribution to mathematics remotely comparable to Europe's - (now including Britain and Germany) - and you're on what we Brits call a very sticky wicket. But then no one in Europe or America knows what that is, do they?