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Post by dukeofpain on Jan 8, 2006 23:03:38 GMT -5
Since when is New Years a "renamed pagan holiday"? It's 2,006 years since Anno Domini-- the year of our lord.Bwa-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha P.S.--Jews have their own calendar, their own New Year. Isn't it Rosh Hashana? It's disingenuous to pretend that the January 1st New Year which marks off 2,006 years since Jesus' arrival in the world DOESN'T represent Christian culture . . . that it's "Western". That's why it's the most hypocritical that Jews celebrate it. P.P.S.--Christmas is far less Christian than New Years. The December 25th celebration pre-dates Christianity, and was used as the birth of the Zoastrian god Mithras (who was also said to be born of a virgin). As for the "solstice," cultures all around the world have been celebrating far earlier than that. So for Jews to turn their noses up at Christmas . . . and to celebrate the 2,006 years since the birth of Jesus [in New Years], is the height of hypocrisy. They're on far stronger ground celebrating the once-pagan holidays like Christmas, Halloween, Easter, etc. Hell, Chinese immigrants come [with a far different culture than Judaism to Christianity] and they have no problem respecting Western Christian traditions and participating in them. That's why it's mind-boggling that so many Jews act toward Christmas the way vampires react toward holy water. Hell, look at those Israeli thugs beating up a man in a Santa suit. Why aren't "hate crimes" being lodged against anti-Christian Jews? Er . . .uh . . . never mind. We all know the truth behind that one. It's becuase they historically had unspeakable contmept and hatred for the "jesus" character. Spitting at a crucifix or steepled cross was near universal, now all of a sudden after WWII they deny any such hate, and further use it to show christian hate (mel gibson) towards them. Christians historically had aninomosity for jew "christ killers"... sure.. but the jews hated christ, so, like always, the story has two sides. Hey hey now, that was out of line. Towards all who celebrate "Kwanza".....
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Post by dukeofpain on Jan 8, 2006 23:10:37 GMT -5
Is it not true that israel follows a lunar calendar and are currently in the year 5000 something? The Hebrew calendar is the official calendar of Israel's government, but the Gregorian calendar is much more widely used in Israel's business and day-to-day affairs. What's your point? Thats the thing about globalist commerce being dominated by the west. Doesn't change the fact that they were celebrating the christian new year.
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Post by nymos on Jan 8, 2006 23:29:05 GMT -5
The Hebrew calendar is the official calendar of Israel's government, but the Gregorian calendar is much more widely used in Israel's business and day-to-day affairs. What's your point? Thats the thing about globalist commerce being dominated by the west. Doesn't change the fact that they were celebrating the christian new year. Again, New Year is not a Christian holiday. Christmas is. New Years is celebrated all over the world, with nothing religious attached to it. Celebrations just basically include a party. It's highly likely that those kids at the party were from ex-Soviet countries. In Soviet Union, New Year was celebrated by everyone be they Christian, Jewish, or Muslim.
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Post by dukeofpain on Jan 8, 2006 23:35:25 GMT -5
I see you like to resort to misguided sarcasm with no substance, when have nothing else to say. You effectively ignore what I've said, and decided to put words in my mouth. I'm not going to repeat myself third time on this. Your sarcasm is misguided. I would love to read this article. I would like to read exactly what he said. As far as I know synagogues were closed down as well. Jewish Bolsheviks weren't relegious at all. BTW, your misguided sarcasm is noted again. Trust me, I've googled it and couldn't find the Sun Post article. I can't believe it's that hard for you to provide a link. I'm kind of getting suspicious. Again with the stupid sarcasm, which has no substance and no merit. Why are you putting words in my mouth? Did you read this: "Sure, there's some antagonism between Christians and Jews, Christians and Muslims (maybe more than some), Muslims and Jews (well a lot, not some here). But to listen to you it's "the Jews" who are solely responsible for every interreligious antagonism." or this: "You act as if Jews are unilaterly responsible for any Jewish/Christian antagonism. Should I start bringing up examples of Christian anti-Jewish antagonism? You know what, it would be a lot more serious than Jews not buying stained glass." Written for the Sunday Herald in 1920 under the title "Zionism vs Bolshevism" www.sovereignty.org.uk/siteinfo/newsround/zvb/zvb1.htmlAmong the most notable was a certain, Mr Trotsky (Bronstein), whom was reared at a Russian Talmudic school specializing in the "moral philosophy" of the Shulchan Aruch. Regardless if he believed in god, or any Jewish Bolshevist for that matter, matters insofar as them believing in the existence of a god. God doesn't make a Jew, and a Jew need not believe in god to be a Jew. This part is especially interesting, being written in 1920. The same phenomenon has been presented in Germany (especially in Bavaria), so far as this madness has been allowed to prey upon the temporary prostration of the German people. Churchill knows all to well about it being "temporary".
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Post by dukeofpain on Jan 9, 2006 1:19:59 GMT -5
Thats the thing about globalist commerce being dominated by the west. Doesn't change the fact that they were celebrating the christian new year. Again, New Year is not a Christian holiday. Christmas is. New Years is celebrated all over the world, with nothing religious attached to it. Celebrations just basically include a party. It's highly likely that those kids at the party were from ex-Soviet countries. In Soviet Union, New Year was celebrated by everyone be they Christian, Jewish, or Muslim. Look, there are 2 things that make up the new year celebration. The first being the day, Janurary 1st, which was designated by the pagan-stoic Romans. The second is the Year, which was designated by the presumed date of the birth of Jesus. So regardless if your celebrating in a "secular" atmosphere, doesn't change that it's a pagan/christian european tradition. There was no mention of any previous nationality. Only the mention of a nightclub, a nightclub that a man in a santa suit went to celebrate and was attacked for the supposed offence of being a christian.
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Post by nymos on Jan 9, 2006 2:15:04 GMT -5
Thanks Duke. This is a very nice article by Churchill. Droop said: "Winston Churchill, too. In a 1920 article he wrote about the Jewish role in Bolshevims, he lamented the fact that the Bolsheviks banned all churches but left synagogues alone." Churchill said: "The fact that in many cases Jewish interests and Jewish places of worship are excepted by the Bolsheviks from their universal hostility has tended more and more to associate the Jewish race in Russia with the villainies which are now being perpetrated." First let's note that Churchill's assertions were not as exact as Droop would like us believe. Churchill is being rather vague and is trying very hard to link Bolshevism to Jews. It's a well-known fact that Churchill was a Zionist and vehemently anti-Bolshevik. This article very well illustrates this. We can see how he skillfully establishes the dichotomy of the Zionist Jews (or the good Jews) and Bolshevik Jews ( the bad Jews), building it step by step, from start to finish. The intent is clear: to motivate Zionist Jews into action against the Bolshevik threat. But all facts indicate that Churchill was wrong on Bolshevik treatment of Jews, be it intentionally or not. Let me provide some examples: The Rosh Hashana kibbutz is a large prayer assemblage of Breslover Hasidim held on the Jewish New Year. It specifically refers to the pilgrimage of tens of thousands of Hasidim to the city of Uman, Ukraine, but also refers to sizable Rosh Hashana gatherings of Breslover Hasidim in other locales around the world. Despite the Communist ban on public prayer gatherings, Breslover Hasidim in Russia continued to gather clandestinely every Rosh Hashana during the 1920s and 1930s. In 1934, the Soviets ostensibly granted permission for 28 Hasidim to travel to Uman for Rosh Hashana. In fact, it was a ruse to discover their identities—16 were murdered while still in Uman and 12 were exiled to Siberia. Only four of the exiles survived. In 1936, the authorities shut down the kloyz built by Reb Noson and turned it into a metalworking factory. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosh_Hashana_kibbutz_(Breslov)
"Soon after seizing power, the Bolsheviks established the Yevsektsiya. Yevsektsiya was the Jewish section of the Soviet Communist party created to challenge and eventually destroy the rival Bund and Zionist parties, suppress Judaism and "bourgeois nationalism" and replace traditional Jewish culture with "proletarian culture", as well as to impose the ideas of Dictatorship of the proletariat onto the Jewish worker class. An important aim of the Yevsektsiya was to mobilize the world Jewry in favor of the Soviet regime. The first conference of Yevsektsiya took place in October 1918.
The Bolsheviks considered Hebrew a "reactionary language" since it was associated with both Judaism and Zionism, and was officially banned by the Narkompros (Commissariat of Education) in 1919. Hebrew books and periodicals ceased to appear and were seized from the libraries. Teachers and students who attempted to study Hebrew language were pilloried and sentenced for "counter revolutionary" activities. The famous Habima Theater had to obtain official permission to exist from Lenin, but was branded a "zionist nest" and in early 1920s was forced to leave Russia for long world tour. It settled for good in the British Mandate of Palestine in 1926."
"The Bolsheviks seem to have been personally rather atheistic and internationalistic, more concerned with the plight of the working class in general rather than with any ethnic or religious group"
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_Russia_and_Soviet_Union
"Even though many of the Old Bolsheviks were ethnically Jewish, they sought to uproot Judaism and Zionism and established the Yevsektsiya to achieve this goal. By the end of 1940s the Communist leadership of the former USSR liquidated almost all Jewish organizations, with the exception of a few token synagogues. These synagogues were then placed under police surveillance, both openly and through the use of informers. The anti-Semitic campaign of 1948-1953 against so-called "rootless cosmopolitans," the fabrication of the "Doctors' plot," the rise of "Zionology" and subsequent activities of official organizations such as the Anti-Zionist committee of the Soviet public were officially carried out under the banner of "anti-Zionism," but the use of this term could not obscure the anti-Semitic content of these campaigns, and by the mid-1950s the state persecution of Soviet Jews emerged as a major human rights issue in the West and domestically." en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Jews More over I would like Droop to go up to some old Russian Jews and tell them how good they had it that their synagogues weren't shut down and transformed into a warehouse or a factory or left to rot. I would love to see their response. Bwahahahaha! ------------------------ Anyway, this is a great piece by Churchill and I agree with his overall sentiment of pro-Zionism. Don't you, Dukey? "The struggle which is now beginning between the Zionist and Bolshevik Jews is little less than a struggle for the soul of the Jewish people." - Churchill And we all know which side has won this struggle!
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Post by nymos on Jan 9, 2006 2:22:33 GMT -5
Again, New Year is not a Christian holiday. Christmas is. New Years is celebrated all over the world, with nothing religious attached to it. Celebrations just basically include a party. It's highly likely that those kids at the party were from ex-Soviet countries. In Soviet Union, New Year was celebrated by everyone be they Christian, Jewish, or Muslim. Look, there are 2 things that make up the new year celebration. The first being the day, Janurary 1st, which was designated by the pagan-stoic Romans. The second is the Year, which was designated by the presumed date of the birth of Jesus. So regardless if your celebrating in a "secular" atmosphere, doesn't change that it's a pagan/christian european tradition. There was no mention of any previous nationality. Only the mention of a nightclub, a nightclub that a man in a santa suit went to celebrate and was attacked for the supposed offence of being a christian. New Year, in US and all over the world is celebrated as a secular holiday. There are no religious strings attached. It's not all Christians that gather in Times Square in NYC to mark the New Year. In countries like China and Japan, it's not Christians who celebrate it. It was dishonest of Droop to accuse Jews celebrating New Years as being hypocritical. That's like saying that because so many Jews use Latin alphabet, they are hypocritical because they have their own Hebrew alphabet. What's funny is that then he goes around and accuses Jews of not adapting to Western culture. Now THAT'S the height of hypocricy. He was attacked because the kids were intoxicated and stupid. If not this guy they would no doubt attack someone else.
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Post by Crimson Guard on Jan 9, 2006 2:34:25 GMT -5
There is no need to exaggerate the part played in the creation of Bolshevism and in the actual bringing about of the Russian Revolution by these international and for the most part atheistical Jews. It is certainly a very great one; it probably outweighs all others. With the notable exception of Lenine, the majority of the leading figures are Jews. Moreover, the principal inspiration and driving power comes from the Jewish leaders. . . In the Soviet institutions the predominance of Jews is even more astounding. And the prominent if not the principal part in the system of terrorism applied by the extraordinary Commissions for combating Counter Revolution has been taken by Jews, and in some notable cases by Jewesses. The same evil prominence was obtained by Jews in the brief period of terror during which Bela Kun ruled in Hungary. The same phenomenon has been presented in Germany (especially in Bavaria), so far as this madness has been allowed to prey upon the temporary prostration of the German people. Although in all these countries there are many non-Jews every whit as bad as the worst of the Jewish revolutionaries, the part played by the latter in proportion to their numbers in the population is astonishing. ("Zionism Versus Bolshevism: A Struggle for the Soul of the Jewish People." Illustrated Sunday Herald, London, February 8, 1920).
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Post by nymos on Jan 9, 2006 2:45:43 GMT -5
There is no need to exaggerate the part played in the creation of Bolshevism and in the actual bringing about of the Russian Revolution by these international and for the most part atheistical Jews. It is certainly a very great one; it probably outweighs all others. With the notable exception of Lenine, the majority of the leading figures are Jews. Moreover, the principal inspiration and driving power comes from the Jewish leaders. . . In the Soviet institutions the predominance of Jews is even more astounding. And the prominent if not the principal part in the system of terrorism applied by the extraordinary Commissions for combating Counter Revolution has been taken by Jews, and in some notable cases by Jewesses. The same evil prominence was obtained by Jews in the brief period of terror during which Bela Kun ruled in Hungary. The same phenomenon has been presented in Germany (especially in Bavaria), so far as this madness has been allowed to prey upon the temporary prostration of the German people. Although in all these countries there are many non-Jews every whit as bad as the worst of the Jewish revolutionaries, the part played by the latter in proportion to their numbers in the population is astonishing. ("Zionism Versus Bolshevism: A Struggle for the Soul of the Jewish People." Illustrated Sunday Herald, London, February 8, 1920). Crimson, is that excerpt from the article your input into the argument or are you just showing us your favorite part of the piece?
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Post by Crimson Guard on Jan 9, 2006 3:17:41 GMT -5
Can say the same thing about you....Don't post a small little segment and run off laughing with your misconstrued interpretation. Post the complete thing.
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Post by nymos on Jan 9, 2006 3:24:18 GMT -5
Can say the same thing about you....Don't post a small little segment and run off laughing with your misconstrued interpretation. Post the complete thing. Complete thing of what? And who's laughing?
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Post by Crimson Guard on Jan 9, 2006 3:28:30 GMT -5
You didnt pull a "Bwahahahaha" up their?
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Post by nymos on Jan 9, 2006 3:34:55 GMT -5
You didnt pull a "Bwahahahaha" up their? Relax. I was parodying Droop. So post the complete thing of what? "Misconstrued interpretation" of what?
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Post by Drooperdoo on Jan 9, 2006 15:14:54 GMT -5
Nymos says that only Christians are bad. Jews, Muslims, Shintoists, etc. have no ill-feelings toward European hegemony. They absolutely love Christians.
Remember those Afghan muslims who were arresting Christian missionaries? --No, Nymos said it didn't happen. (They don't associate Christians with historic imperialism, and there's no backlash at all.)
Or those arrests of Christians in China.
Nope, that never happened, either.
And Bolsheviks shutting down churches and allowing synagogues to exist freely? Nope. That didn't happen either (Nymos assures us.) Why should we believe Winston Churchill over Nymos! Not one shred of animosity among Jews were who oppressed, ostracized and killed.
They love Christianity and can't get enough!
So let's take a poll: All in favor of tying up Nymos, dressing him in a Santa Claus suit and dropping him in the middle of a "Sons of Abraham" meeting in Tel-Aviv?
All in favor say "Aye!"
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Post by nymos on Jan 9, 2006 15:27:02 GMT -5
Nymos says that only Christians are bad. Jews, Muslims, Shintoists, etc. have no ill-feelings toward European hegemony. They absolutely love Christians. Remember those Afghan muslims who were arresting Christian missionaries? --No, Nymos said it didn't happen. (They don't associate Christians with historic imperialism, and there's no backlash at all.) Or those arrests of Christians in China. Nope, that never happened, either. And Bolsheviks shutting down churches and allowing synagogues to exist freely? Nope. That didn't happen either (Nymos assures us.) Why should we believe Winston Churchill over Nymos! Not one shred of animosity among Jews were who oppressed, ostracized and killed. They love Christianity and can't get enough! So let's take a poll: All in favor of tying up Nymos, dressing him in a Santa Claus suit and dropping him in the middle of a "Sons of Abraham" meeting in Tel-Aviv? All in favor say "Aye!" Is that what you resort to? Lying? Why do you do this Droop? Where did I say "only Christians are bad"? Why do you have to stoop to such a low level? Did you even bother to read my post?
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