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Post by MC anunnaki on Jan 11, 2006 10:45:52 GMT -5
Well, have you? What are you feelings about the fate we all share and probably will never escape?
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Post by anodyne on Jan 11, 2006 11:17:42 GMT -5
I have no fear of death itself (oh, but I am afraid of suffering physical pain!). What I am afraid of is not accomplishing the two goals I've set out for myself before my end comes. I should be able to accomplish these two goals by the age of 32 at the latest. Afterwards I could die without distress. Of course, that doesn't mean I would be looking to die. I would like to keep on living since life is enjoyable and there are a lot of minor things I'd like to accomplish and see. But as long as I meet my two goals I can relax with the satisfaction that my life had meaning.
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Post by dukeofpain on Jan 11, 2006 11:34:42 GMT -5
Well, have you? What are you feelings about the fate we all share and probably will never escape? Extinction?
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Post by MC anunnaki on Jan 11, 2006 11:57:35 GMT -5
I was thinking more of your own death and your feelings towards it.
Personally, I'm not afraid of dying nor of physical pain (hey, I gave birth without any anaesthetics). What bothers me is the idea of no afterlife. I mean, I can take dying if it means entering a new world of some sort, but the idea of nothing happening after death makes me sad. For some reason, it makes me feel that this life is a waste.
I also find it depressing that I won't live to see what progress mankind will make and if all doomsday prophets of today will be proven right after all.
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Post by dukeofpain on Jan 11, 2006 12:07:42 GMT -5
I was thinking more of your own death and your feelings towards it. Personally, I'm not afraid of dying nor of physical pain (hey, I gave birth without any anaesthetics). What bothers me is the idea of no afterlife. I mean, I can take dying if it means entering a new world of some sort, but the idea of nothing happening after death makes me sad. For some reason, it makes me feel that this life is a waste. I am the complete opposite. The idea of an after life creeps me out. I really don't even like the idea of "heaven", let alone belive in it . I just think back before I was born, and when I do so I dont have any bad memories, so death doesn't seem all that bad to me if that is what it is like. I have a hunch it'll be self-fullfilling. Maybe it is......
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Post by Crimson Guard on Jan 11, 2006 12:11:45 GMT -5
"You want to live forever"!
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Post by murphee on Jan 11, 2006 15:47:25 GMT -5
Yes, every day, many times a day. I have always been like that about contemplating my mortality. My biggest fear is dying in an accident/violent death. I joke about how I want to die of a disease, of course not too soon...when I am very old. I am particularly excited by advances in technology and would very much like to see what is going on when I'd be 110.
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Post by Soomaal on Jan 11, 2006 15:54:23 GMT -5
I see it like this; we start dying when we are born, we die bit by bit each day until we die for good.
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Post by murphee on Jan 11, 2006 15:59:43 GMT -5
I agree, and I also see it another way: All the time, huge numbers of cells in our bodies are dying and being created. There are cancer cells present at all times in our bodies, and in a healthy individual the immune system is constantly destroying them. My theory is that people die from cancer when this process is no longer properly taking place.
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Post by Liquid Len on Jan 11, 2006 16:48:00 GMT -5
I think it's not really clear if our biological death is the end of our conscious existence or not. Therefore it isn't very fruitful to discuss our attitude to such an unclear event. Of course we might discuss the pros and cons of an afterlife, but we could as well just decide that by "death" and "mortality" we mean the end of our conscious existence (whether there is such a thing or not). And then we could discuss our attitude towards it. I'm going to do the latter, for once.
Some have argued (especially Epicurus) that death (always understood in the above defined way) can't be bad because it's the end of all perception. And since (as they think) everything good and bad consists in some perception, it can't be something bad. I'll admit that a corpse doesn't perceive his state of being dead as something negative, but I would also reply that merely being able of perceptions and experiences is already something good (at least as it can enable to experience other, more intrinsic goods) and therefore the loss of it must be bad. Now, some will say that there is no "loss", because in the moment of death the person entirely ceases to exist, i.e. there is no one who "loses" something, and definitely no one who isn't able of perceptions anymore. But I think that being able to perceive, to think, and to experience is better than not existing at all, therefore death must be negative.
Often people think that death is even worse because it prevents you from fulfilling your wishes and aspirations etc. Some have argued (especially Lucretius) that this isn't true, because a dead body doesn't have any wishes and aspirations, therefore it can't be called negative that it is unable to fulfill them... But I think here we have to distinguish between "death" as the state of being dead, for which this reasoning might be really true, and the "moment of death" as the dividing line between the states of being alive and of being dead, for which it is much more dubious. On the one hand it's true: If you die all of a sudden, you won't notice that you can't fulfill your wishes anymore. You won't experience that you've failed, and it won't seem negative to you at all. But on the other hand, now that you are alive, you'll definitely try to avoid dying, if you want to achieve something, and you'd be sad if you knew that you had only very little time left (which might be the case if you suddenly got heavily sick).
One thing seems certain: If you had to live forever, it would be necessary for you to evolve and to change, or otherwise your life would sooner or later become awfully boring and meaningless. Some have argued that you might get psychical problems from such extreme changes (considering that we are talking about eternity). But I'd reply that I have already changed a lot since my birth and it didn't make me that sick. Others have argued that your goals and wishes in the far future would have to be totally different from your current ones, and that you therefore cannot reasonably be wishing that you are going to live in the far future. However, I don't find this to be a very convincing argument. I personally don't care what my wishes would be then, I'd be happy if I could have any at all...
Jeff Malpas, a contemporary philosopher, has argued that you can only really lead a life if you think that it will have an end. He sort of compares such a correctly led life with a piece of art, something that can be moulded into a sculpture, or a novel, and this can only be something finite. If you live forever, you could at best only lead a series of an infinite number of very loosely connected lives. Well, I think he's right about that, but would this be worse than extinction? He says that then everything would be possible and nothing would be important. And that you'd be everything and nobody at once. But if you are really leading one of this series of lives - this wouldn't be true, would it?
So, to sum it up, I would regard my personal death as something negative.
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Post by murphee on Jan 11, 2006 17:17:39 GMT -5
I believe in the afterlife, but one thing seems clear--physical death is the end of the body and the stay here on Earth. It can't be proven, but I believe that the spirit lives on after death and it goes to a place or places not here on Earth. My mother was an Atheist who did not believe in the afterlife, and some weird things happened to me after her death. A few times, I was sitting at home alone and I heard her voice say, "I love you, (my name)." My dog's ears perked up at the same time. It may be a coincidence or just my weirdness, but it seemed very real; another time I saw a ball of sparks travel around the ceiling (on the day of her death). Things like this happened for around six months after her death. I never had experienced anything like this at any time of my life until after her death. I would see and hear things in a sober, drug-free state. Every time it happened, it made me feel happy. I would like to experience it again; nothing has happened since around 2001. I think my mother was checking up on us and trying to communicate.
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Post by greatness on Jan 11, 2006 20:54:24 GMT -5
Like Ferdowsi says would you feel sorry if a random fruit was knocked off the tree before it was rippened. Likewise fate knocks us off one by one. And we can all sit and speculate but at the end none of us have crossed over ourselves to know anything. Although I must say, everyone (from all types of backgrounds) who has temporarily died (as in had a cardiac arrest or something and then been revived) has said that it is a wonderful experience. Though I have not died myself, so I cant confer on this.
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Post by murphee on Jan 11, 2006 21:57:17 GMT -5
Though I never rounded the corner enough to see anything on the other side, there were two times during 1979-1980 where I feel I got close to death. One time, it was illness that resulted in a long hospital stay, another time I jumped out of a speeding car to avoid an assault. I was changed forever; to this day I appreciate life in a way I never had before. It takes very little to make me feel happy.
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Post by stella22 on Jan 11, 2006 22:09:26 GMT -5
Supposedly there's an information database called the Ashkashic Records in the afterlife. It sounds like a new and improved version of the internet. I hope I browse/surf the Ashkashic Records in eternity, lol.
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Post by nordicyouth on Jan 11, 2006 23:02:46 GMT -5
I'm not afraid of death. I just want to die with dignity and courage after a long life...perhaps executed by firing squad for being a dissident against some totalitarian regime...If I could live forever I would (never aging past 30 of course)...as there are some things I want to accomplish.
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