Something Alexandrian will not like.

[Berter]

Erudite said:

Berter, quit trolling:

Seriously, Do you think you do beat me with your vague articles!?. I do proceed by logical reasoning while all you do is posting any 'scientific paper' you find on the Net believing it is of some academic value ...

Kathryn A. Bard
The Egyptian Predynastic: A Review of the Evidence

Journal of Field Archaeology 21 (1994) 265--288

In the 4th millennium B.C. two different Predynastic cultures, both of which practiced agriculture, evolved in Egypt: the Nagada culture in the south and the Maadi culture in the north.

How much different are those two predynastic cultures of A.E!?.

I'm certain they are not 'that' different and were developped by two similar human populations.

Settlement sites of the latter are much better preserved, but in the south, where most of the archaeological evidence is from cemeteries, there is much greater evidence for the evolution of social hierarchies and complex societies. A review of the archaeological evidence for the Predynastic suggests that the early state had its cultural origins in the south,

As Baladi, you are just localizing the home of the earliest forms of A.E civilisation. That passage says nothing about the race that developped the southern culture of nagada.

although the processes involved in the emergence of the state of Egypt can only be hypothesized at this time.

That statement shows that Kathryn A. Bard's 'conclusion' is only a hypothesis. Why did you presented it as a proof!?

Now post your rpoof that Upper egyptians were nothing more than slaves to Lower Egyptians.

You still have to proof your beliefs.

Charlie, learn to use your brain (--- speculation). The Net is full of shit ...

[eufrenio]

Erudite said:

“In Ways Unacademical”: The Reception of Carleton S. Coon’s The Origin of Races

Of course this in itself doesn't make his work nor himself white supremacist, but he was involved with them.

Of course, he was involved with.. his cousin, Putnam!

And he knew most of the anthropologists who were members of the IAAEE! They were his colleagues after all, no wonder!
Coon was a man of his time, let it rest at that.

[Minstrel]

Charlie, learn to use your brain (--- speculation). The Net is full of shit ...

And I suppose you are a geneticists/archeologist extraordinaire? Ofcourse you can rebuke such things, internet scholarly studies, psssshht who need em? berThor is a veritable fountain of scholarship and knowledge himself!

[Minstrel]

Well, those archeological excavations just prove that UE was the home where A.E civilisation started. I said above that this region was originally inhabited by the same human type as the one that dominated in Lower Egypt. I believe that those southern 'lower egyptians' are the one responsible of the earliest forms of civilisation in Ancient Egypt.

LOL berbers are not truly indigenous to africa, studies have shown they are of near-eastern origin, in other words, a back migration.

Blacks have always been there, LOL people populated every corner of the world in a span of the last 30,000-10,000 years, is it really unlikely that there no blacks in northeast africa? Berter, your not only being dsihonest, your probably being dishonest with yourself, everyone can plainly see your bias.

[mike2]

I assume the "blacks" that originally lived in Northwest Africa were of the Khoisanid and elongated West African type.

Erudite said:

No one says anything about white Americans identifying with Greeks and Romans so why single out American blacks with stupid lies?

Hey, I'm a white American of partial Greek descent. So some of us do have that right.

eufrenio said:

Coon was a man of his time, let it rest at that.

Agreed. I read that article and that's the same conclusion I came up with.

[Crimson Guard]

The Sarahan desert served as barrier to the Negroid peoples of Africa..They where not in North Africa,and certianly not in any such large numbers .

www.journals.uchicago.edu/AJHG/journal/issues/v75n2/41184/41184.text.html?erFrom=8787131387466121367Guest

<<"True" Black Africans appear as a recent adaptive radiation in the above dendrograms, apparently branching off from an ancestral Pygmy population -- a line of ancestry also indicated by osteological data (Coon 1962:651-656; Watson et al. 1996). This radiation seems to have occurred somewhere in West Africa. Before the Bantu expansion about 3,000 years ago, true Black Africans were absent from the continent's central, eastern, and southern regions (Cavalli-Sforza 1986:361-362; Oliver 1966). They were also absent from the middle Nile until about 4,000 years ago, at which time they begin to appear in paintings from Pharaonic Egypt and in skeletal remains from Nubia (Junker 1921).>>

Link

racialreality.blogspot.com/2005_01_01_racialreality_archive.html

[mike2]

CrimsonGuard said:

The Sarahan desert served as barrier to the Negroid peoples of Africa..They where not in North Africa,and certianly not in any such large numbers .

Sure, in later times. But the Sahara wasn't always there. Before it was a desert, the ancestors of the elongated West Africans (I call them Sahelids) could have easily traversed the huge pre-Saharan expanse. And they probably did. In great numbers? I don't know. And let's not forget that even Coon postulated the presence of Khoisan people in North Africa at one point in time. If the Khoisan could travel the distance from North Africa to South Africa or vice versa, then surely black Africans could, too.

CrimsonGuard said:

<<"True" Black Africans appear as a recent adaptive radiation in the above dendrograms, apparently branching off from an ancestral Pygmy population -- a line of ancestry also indicated by osteological data (Coon 1962:651-656; Watson et al. 1996). This radiation seems to have occurred somewhere in West Africa. Before the Bantu expansion about 3,000 years ago, true Black Africans were absent from the continent's central, eastern, and southern regions (Cavalli-Sforza 1986:361-362; Oliver 1966). They were also absent from the middle Nile until about 4,000 years ago, at which time they begin to appear in paintings from Pharaonic Egypt and in skeletal remains from Nubia (Junker 1921).>>

This is part of the problem: the postulation that there is a true black African type. I don't believe in a true Negroid type. There are many Negroid types just as there are many Caucasoid and Mongoloid types. Perhaps the broad Negroids (Paleonegrids, Sudanids, Bantids, etc.) branched off from pygmies. But does that mean that elongated Africans like Nilotids, Aethiopids, and Sahelids are not true black Africans because they do not conform to an extreme "pygmoid" appearance? How do we know that pygmies, broad Negroids, and elongated Negroids didn't all split from the same group?

And even if the peoples of West Africa were different enough from the peoples of pre-Bantu East, Central, and South Africa, that still doesn't make those East, Central, and South Africans Caucasoid by any means. They would simply warrant their own race.

CrimsonGuard said:

Link

racialreality.blogspot.com/2005_01_01_racialreality_archive.html

I enjoy some of RacialReality's work as he amalgamates a number of sources together when he presents his evidence of whatever it is he wants to prove, but he is clearly biased against the idea of black African diversity. And he can't be the bearer of racial reality if he still purports racial myths.

[Crimson Guard]

The research and the results are still the same whether you agree with him or not,doenst really matter.

Theirs very little if any evidence of Negroids being in let alone, being the Original inhabitants of North Africa...It has been Causcaian since probably the dawn of mankind or atleast for over 20,000 years,but certainly in historical times.

[Ponto Hardbottle]

The Elongated African negrids did occupy the savannah that became the Sahara at one time with their bovines and other domesticated animals. The problem is the time factor and the origin of the domesticated animals. There is no evidence that any domesticated bovine or sheep or other species ever originated in Africa. In addition pastoralism requires the domestication of animals, and that form of economy came recently in terms of time to Africa probably no more than 4000 years ago. By that time North Africa was already occupied by caucasoid type people and the two peoples met on the savannah of the old Sahara. It is also from that time that negrid admixture started to trickle into the North from those contacts. The fact is that the negrids are a tropical race and developed there, the North was always temperate and already occupied by people who have farming economies based on the production of grains like wheat and barley. The elongated negrids mostly moved eastwards, the Fulbe are an exception, after absorbing some caucasoid admixture and eventually ended up in East Africa as the Tutsi, some Sudan negrids and the Maasai. They were not farmers and they avoided the temperate lands occupied by already establish farming populations.

[Minstrel]

CrimsonGuard said:

The research and the results are still the same whether you agree with him or not,doenst really matter.

Theirs very little if any evidence of Negroids being in let alone, being the Original inhabitants of North Africa...It has been Causcaian since probably the dawn of mankind or atleast for over 20,000 years,but certainly in historical times.

Dude "the caucasian" is a new group, they are not the "original inhabitants of north africa" that is absurd. They did'nt spring up from the dirt, they migrated there, who did they meet? black africans that have been living in the vicinity for thousands of years. Quotes of coon from the 1960's are not going to help your case.

lol you forgot black africans are actually native not to west africa but somewhere in the northeastern area (sudan, ethiopia) and the sahara was not always a desert, it only recently became a desert.

The ONLY people you could actually call "indigenous" or "native" to a geographical area are SS africans, everyone else are colonisers.

[mike2]

Were there Capoids in North Africa or is that a myth?

[Minstrel]

Were there Capoids in North Africa or is that a myth?

I heard they got pushed to southern africa by iron age africans but I'd have to find out more about that. They are actually not the most ancient group, they are related to the even older "sandawe" peoples of tanzania who speak another click language. Actually you might be surprised to hear that masai carry some of the oldest lineages.

[topdog]

Ponto said:

The Elongated African negrids did occupy the savannah that became the Sahara at one time with their bovines and other domesticated animals. The problem is the time factor and the origin of the domesticated animals. There is no evidence that any domesticated bovine or sheep or other species ever originated in Africa.

This is an outright lie, I suggest you read the works of Fred Wendorf, who through studies has shown that animal domestication was **NOT*** imported into Africa.

In addition pastoralism requires the domestication of animals, and that form of economy came recently in terms of time to Africa probably no more than 4000 years ago.

More like in 6000 BC and you can even see pastoral scenes in Saharan rock art.

The elongated negrids mostly moved eastwards, the Fulbe are an exception, after absorbing some caucasoid admixture and eventually ended up in East Africa as the Tutsi, some Sudan negrids and the Maasai. They were not farmers and they avoided the temperate lands occupied by already establish farming populations.

Tutsis and Masai don't have Caucasoid mixture and elongated Africans are **NOT** a mixture of Caucasoids and 'true Negroids'.

[topdog]

eufrenio said:

Of course, he was involved with.. his cousin, Putnam!

And he knew most of the anthropologists who were members of the IAAEE! They were his colleagues after all, no wonder!
Coon was a man of his time, let it rest at that.

He was a man of his time who postualted ridiculous that Tutsis, Masai, and Somalis were skeletally 'white'. No one should take his theories on Africa peoples serious.

[topdog]

Mike said:

Were there Capoids in North Africa or is that a myth?

The skeletal evidence does not indicate a Sanid presence in North Africa.