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Post by Ilmatar on Jan 2, 2006 13:05:07 GMT -5
Actually latvian and estonian serfs in 16.-18./19. century were SLAVES. Landlords selled, changed etc. them (what can happen only with slaves). Serfs had no rights at all, their children weren't able to get freedom. The only place where serfs were able to get freedon were free towns with special rights. But they had to live there at least 2 years and all the time hide from their landlords who were hunting after them. Serfs who tried to escape and were catched often were punished even with death. There is a family legend according to which some of my ancestors were Latvian fishermen who managed to escape their landlond in the 17th century. It might be true, since many Estonian and Latvian serfs escaped and settled in Finland in the 17th century. And since Finland wasn't actually a rich land of hope in those times, they really must have been desperate to get out.
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Post by zemelmete on Jan 2, 2006 13:42:35 GMT -5
In 18.-19. century germans claimed that estonians and latvians are "lower developed" (imagine - it was said about one of the most blonde and blue-eyed people in the world LOL) and that it is reason why german landlords can rule ower them. Even estonians and latvians nowdays have their own countries, they still have some inferiority complex kept from those slavery days. I have heard countless times about like that: "we, latvians, are just little, unimportant people, we can't do much, we are weak etc.". Isn't that real slave inferiority complex?
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Post by Brasidas on Jan 4, 2006 16:10:09 GMT -5
Blueskygod,
If memory serves me correctly the word Slav originates from the Greek word Sclave. Which means slave. The first mention of the word Sclavealso Sclavesians comes from the Byzantines in the 6th century A.D/A.C.E.
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Post by dodona79 on Jan 4, 2006 16:39:03 GMT -5
Ethiopians have enslaved Somalis and sold them to arabs and indians alot. Here is some info from a somali site www.ogaden.com/History.htm ....... and selling women and children as slaves.
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Post by dodona79 on Jan 4, 2006 16:41:34 GMT -5
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Post by dodona79 on Jan 4, 2006 16:44:52 GMT -5
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Post by dodona79 on Jan 4, 2006 16:48:04 GMT -5
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Post by dodona79 on Jan 4, 2006 16:50:36 GMT -5
64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:bAWL5e7gNXwJ:www.dehai.org/conflict/articles/selam_ethiopia_art_of_lying.html+%22ethiopian+slave+trade%22&hl=enThe most paralyzing thing one has to consider in the history of this unfortunate affairs is, the depth and intensity of the slave commerce that went on in Ethiopia, literally century in and century out, which has left a great insecurity over those who were its victims be it the Oromo, the Wolayta, or the Benshangul. And although they, at the present moment, by definition, are the majority of today's Ethiopia, in reality, they still are at the mercy of the descendants of the Abyssinian slaveholders, principally the Amhara and their Tigrean cohorts. The chilling tragedy about these people that one is forced to face in reading the history of the Ethiopian slave trade is, how humans were treated as if they were herds of animals. As historian Mordechai Abir recounted, those who were caught by slave traders "were examined like cattle by their purchasers, the sullen Shankela (Abyssinian's pejorative name given to any person with black face) fetches a price proportioned to the muscular appearance of his or her giant frame; and the child of tender years is valued according to the promise of future development. Even the shame faced and the slender-clad maiden is subjected to every known indignity, whilst the price of her charms is estimated according to the regularity of her features, the symmetry of her budding form, and the luxuriance of her braided locks." (M. Abir, page 61) What is not known to the Western world and where Ethiopian intellectuals like Wondimu do not want to talk about it is the fact that "Ethiopia has always been known for its slaves who were much sought after in the Islamic world". As Abir pointed out (see page 53) "the most important item in the foreign trade Ethiopia had for years was the exportation of slaves." "This can easily be proved," asserted Mr. Abir, "by the hoards of thalers in the treasuries of some of the rulers of the Ethiopian plateau" which, I am forced to add, were mainly Wondimu's forbearers, the Amhara and the Tigreans. Abir went on to say that, "the HABASHA slaves, as Ethiopian slaves were commonly called by slave merchants, were not actually Ethiopians in the strict meaning of the Amhara and the Tigreans, as they came mainly from the Galla (a pejorative name the Amhara gave to the indigenous Oromos) and the Sidama areas in southern and western Ethiopia and to lesser extent the Shanqella areas that surrounds Ethiopia's proper."
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Post by Dagaalyahan on Jan 4, 2006 18:06:06 GMT -5
^^LMAO!!!!
Somalis used to ship your kind off of Zeyla you fool, who have you enslaved? Why do you think your people eat raw meat to begin with? Ask mom and dad dude.
Ps. That link is bogus.. the Ogadeni's are known to make up sh1t inorder to attract attention and gain international support for their case: Defeating Ethiopia.
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Post by Polako on Jan 4, 2006 21:11:30 GMT -5
Blueskygod, If memory serves me correctly the word Slav originates from the Greek word Sclave. Which means slave. The first mention of the word Sclavealso Sclavesians comes from the Byzantines in the 6th century A.D/A.C.E. In Slavic languages Slav means a person who can speak. That's opposed to Niemiec (Nemets, Nemec), a person who cannot speak. In Polish, Niemiec means German. Slowo (Slovo) means word....and Slavs are known as Slowianie (Slovianie). It's got nothing to do with Greek Sclave.
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Post by dukeofpain on Jan 4, 2006 23:31:00 GMT -5
Actually 'slav' originates from 'honorable', I think. edit: It appears 'slav' is a bit difficult to translate. I don't think anythings proven 100% as to the origin of the word. I thought I had heard it came from Germans using it to denote people that are "stupid" i.e., (not being able to communicate). Many other names have similar origin. Like "barbarian", which was from the Greek word "barbaros" which meant stupid/foreigner unable to communicate. Apparently the "Bar-bar" was onomatopoeia because the stupid/foreigners (northerners) sounded like dogs barking when they spoke.
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Post by Dienekes on Jan 4, 2006 23:35:46 GMT -5
Originally, Slavs were called Sklavenoi by Greeks when they first appeared, and this did not mean slave.
However, the word came to mean slave, probably because Slavs were frequently used as slaves, at least by the Arabs, and Ottomans, and, I believe by the Germans as well. I have no idea where the first association of Slav with slave appeared though.
"Etymology: Middle English sclave, from Old French or Medieval Latin; Old French esclave, from Medieval Latin sclavus, from Sclavus Slavic; from the frequent enslavement of Slavs in central Europe"
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Post by Polako on Jan 5, 2006 8:36:35 GMT -5
I don't think anythings proven 100% as to the origin of the word. I thought I had heard it came from Germans using it to denote people that are "stupid" i.e., (not being able to communicate). Other way around... The Slavic word for Germans (Niemcy) means dumb ones.
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Post by dukeofpain on Jan 5, 2006 9:11:02 GMT -5
I don't think anythings proven 100% as to the origin of the word. I thought I had heard it came from Germans using it to denote people that are "stupid" i.e., (not being able to communicate). Other way around... The Slavic word for Germans (Niemcy) means dumb ones. That makes more sense.
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Post by OdinofOssetia on Jan 5, 2006 22:23:58 GMT -5
During the 18th century perhaps the most oppressed and exploited peasants in Europe were in the Belarussian-Lithuanian-Polish Commonwealth. Things like fishing in the pond of the "master" were punishable by death. The situation was so bad that the serfs are even known to have escaped across the border to Russia, because serfdom there was not as bad.About the ancient trade in the White Slavic slaves you can read here: michalw.narod.ru/SlavicSpain.html
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